Paul Teutul Sr. and Paul M. Teutul jr.
I am sure that many of you in the motorcycle world have watched the TV show American Chopper. American Chopper is a reality TV show about the company Orange County Choppers. Its stars are the infamous Teutul family; Paul Teutul Sr., his son Paul Jr., and of course Mikey.
Paul Teutul Sr. and Paul M. Teutul had a very public falling out, which was chronicled on American Chopper. In the Season 6 premiere, Paul Sr. and son had a contentious contract dispute, which led to Paul Jr.’s departure from the company. After a brief reconciliation, Paul Jr. left the OCC for good to explore other opportunities. In later episodes, Paul Jr. was seen working as a consultant at Orange County Choppers.
It has been reported that Paul Sr. sent a letter to Paul Jr. exercising an alleged right to purchase Paul Jr.’s share of the stock he owns in Orange County Choppers since Paul Jr. no longer works there.
Paul Teutul, Sr. claims he had a deal with his son, Paul M. Teutul, in which he could buy his son’s stock from the Orange County Choppers Holdings, Inc. motorcycle company.
The father, who appears on the television show alongside his son, sent Teutul, Jr. a letter saying he would be exercising his right to buy the stock.
Paul Sr. apparently has filed the lawsuit to the Supreme Court of New York; however I have not seen a copy of the lawsuit heretofore. He also filed a suit against Orange County Choppers, Inc.
In the lawsuit, he claimed damages in excess of $1 million and is asking for an order from the judge to force his son to give him the stock.
My take on the situation is this; yes I have watched the show for years. It is better than watching some of the other crap on TV I will tell you that.
I have been a businessman since I was in my 20’s, when I first got venture capital to start Daylight Data Corporation in Los Angeles, and am now running a successful California law firm.
Being successful at business requires management expertise, capital, and luck. It appears to me that Paul Teutul Sr. has been a very successful businessman. He started out installing railings; he worked hard and built his business into a metal manufacturing company, and then started Orange County Choppers. He then used the TV show American Choppers as a marketing vehicle to build his successful business.
There is no doubt that his son really did help with Orange County Choppers, however, in the end, it is the businessman who keeps a company going.
I learned in law school that you never want to represent friends or family because you will never do well enough in their eyes no matter the outcome in a case.
You would think family run businesses would be the easiest to run because of the trust factor. Let me tell you, it takes a special kind of family to stick together to run a business. Unlike other businesses where you can hire and fire at will, it is kind of hard to fire your son, or your brother, etc.
It is a shame that the Teutul’s family business relationship has apparently broken down. My personal take on the situation is that Paul Jr.’s head grew too big for his britches. He designed motorcycles, he started making money, he got the big house, he got the nice looking girlfriend, he obtained fame, etc. He started screwing off at work. Not coming in on time. He became unreliable to his father. Above all, he disrespected his father on national television.
Look, I know full well Paul Sr. is an asshole sometimes. Hell, he and my father would get along well if they were too meet. Paul Sr. did not ask anything more of his son, than a son should give to his father and a family owned business.
Without Paul Sr.’s capital, management expertise, and experience, Orange County Choppers would be a non entity. Motorcycle designers and fabricators are a dime a dozen. Paul Jr. could be, and has been replaced. I think Orange County Choppers are putting out their best motorcycles now.
I think Paul Sr. wants nothing more than to have his sons with him; as sons, not as monsters.
In my honest opinion, Paul Jr. should go to his father, apologize for being an asshole to his father, make amends, and jump back into the family business. Maybe when his money starts to run out he will.
Life is too short and you only get one father in this world. Paul Jr. and Mickey should jump back on the team for the big win, especially for their family.
Good luck to Orange County Choppers in all of their endeavors.
By California Motorcycle Accident Lawyer and California Biker Attorney Norman Gregory Fernandez, Esq., © 2010
Welcome, my name is 
Norm! I hope goes well tomorrow. I am sure you will be dashing and your bride beautiful! Guess tonight is the bachelor party? Have fun and enjoy. I have said a prayer in hopes that your Dad will be able to be there to share this very special time/occasion with you. If he is not there physically, he will be there in spirit! I am sure that you will have plenty of pictures to post! I look forward to seeing the wedding pictures. Sometimes, your pictures make you feel like you are there too!! You would have been a great photographer….but I doubt the pay is “lawyer pay”!!! Best Wishes to you and your family! By the way…..where you going on a honeymoon??? Now, I really look forward to those pictures!
It is true that the businessman keeps the business going but if you are running a business based on designing motorcycles… Paul Jr. was the designer. Yes, you have the wild haired kid that is good on the computer but it was Junior who came up with the concepts. When the show just needed to have Senior ranting about something then it was Junior who was always taking too long complete the bikes. It got a little old and without Mikey and Junior the show is not what it was.
Senior bad mouthed his own son to his employees. Now, they are his new family. He has a tattoo of his dog, Gus, whom he loves more than his own children. He not only ran off Junior and Mickey, but his other son: too. Not to mention Vinnie and Cody.
Managing a business includes managing people. And, Senior has been a complete failure at that.
Oh, by the way, it was Junior’s designed bike at Daytona that got the TLC deal. Before that, they were making bikes in the basement. And, Senior’s great management skills resulted in Orange County Iron Works going broke. Also, according to another post, Senior spent time in jail for Extortion. I hope that story is not true, but if it is true it says a lot about Senior’s business skills.
Its a lose lose situation all round sr now has no kids that talk to him. but he’s got the big house. and buines.what more could you want. i feel sorry for him he will die a rich lonely lonely bitter ol man.
Life is certainly too short to have bitterness in families. It seems as if the youth of today have absolutely no respect for their elders! Does anyone still watch this show??
We watch the American Choppers show in Japan in cable, but this was the first I had heard of the squabble between Sr. and Jr. — that is, beyond the usual, everyday fighting. I’d imagine, as one who works on family businesses, succession, trusts, etc., the problems started long ago and neither Jr.’s nor Sr.’s temperament is well suited for what I’m sure Sr. really wants, which is a self-made dynasty in which the kids are brought along to take over some day. Hell, we’d mostly all like such a thing. Here in Japan (and also China) there are family businesses that go back 7-800 years! How do they do that? I think a lot involves everybody being willing to pitch in and not be a prima dona. Maybe it is expecting too much in a family like theirs. Too bad, I hope it works out.
A good businessman or not, Paul Sr. treats people like crap. No one, not even a son, should have to put up with the immature fits of rage that Paul, Sr. displays. Paul Jr. may have gotten a big head. But how long would any of us stick around a company where you were insulted, disrespected and yelled at constantly. Not me. My boss where I work now did something like that to me once. I stood nose to nose with him and told him if he ever did that again he’d lose every tooth in his head. My job there was not worth being treated like garbage. I’ve been here a long time now and he’s never raised his voice or insulted me since.
I would not watch the show because of Paul, Sr. I don’t care how big he is. He treats me like that and he’s going down. Anyone that stuck around that place and worked for him was a loser. Being on TV isn’t worth it.
When Paul, Sr. dies, it should be as a lonely old man with no family and no friends.
They are building THEIR best biles now???? Are you kidding??? The Jet Bike, the Black Widow, the Fire Bike, the Statue of Liberty bike… these are amazing artistic accomplishments. Paul said on the show that Paulie owned part of the business (at the time it was 10% – which made me think then that the Dad was ripping the talented son off!)and Paul JR designed the logo and the awesome bikes! And for that he is being sued by his own father???? Obviously it was Sr. who got in over his head and is trying to get money where he can now that the show has been cancelled. Even if it means trying to scam his sone out of more than he already has.
And let’s not even get into the fact that Sr. let his staff talk about and joke about his son. That is just poor form! A true PARENT would NEVER allow that to happen!
I hope Paul Jr gets his own show about starting a design business! I’d watch!
As a person who has been fired many times from my family’s law firm (never for alleged lack of performance), it appears to me that there’s more than a clash of personalities at OCC. A family business is not a partnership, it’s a dictatorship, until the dictator retires or dies, then a new dictator takes over. This is difficult for a son or daughter’s ego to tolerate for 50 years. The father is the business owner for 60 years, the “child” is the employee for 50 years, with no control over how the profit is spent nor invested. The “child” has to pay the price for any mistakes in investing (or losing) the business profit.
Is the new BBQ restaurant a wise investment, or a money pit? Will loss of TV revenue kill OCC, since the economic Depress killed the MC industry (HD lost 85% of revenue last quarter)? If money is borrowed and the HQ not 100% paid for, it’s possible a BK is in their future.
Paul Sr is also a “recovering” alcoholic. Alcoholism includes being a “dry drunk” when not drinking alcohol (diabetic symptoms). Quick temper is a symptom of that. Plus issues of being drunk during their childhood requires counseling to avoid PTSD.
I agree Paul Jr should stop being a little brat about this because if it was not for his father that big headed bitch would just be another peace of shit walking down the street. I am a fabricator myself and let me tell you my dream is to be able to build my own custom bike. But my family comes first,some day I will have the money to back my dream up. My point is this,paul Jr is able to do this every single day and make a lot of money at the same time. Boo fucking who bitch. Paul SR SIR keep rockin these bad ass bikes out and get back on my TV. Good luke to you Sr.
I predict Paul Senior will be bankrupt in 7 years. This loudmouthed, beligerant idiot caught lightnig in a bottle – THANKS TO PAUL JR’S DESIGNS – with the reality show. With a weekly TV show as advertising and Jr’s bikes OCC was a powerhouse IN SPITE OF Paul Sr. Now that the talent has left and Sr is left to his own devices sans the cable TV spotlight OCC will shirivel and die with Paul Sr screaming to the bitter end that it’s everyone’s fault for his demise but his own.
I live in the UK where the show is aired way behind the US. Would someone please explain what happened to Vinnie and some of the other regulars who seem to have departed. In addition, it is sad to see any family break-up least of all one so much in the public domain. There were times however, when I felt that the friction between the ‘Paul’s’ made more compelling viewing than the M/C that was the then current project. I, for one, would be sad if this ‘dynasty’ ceased to be. Perhaps there are more miles in a comparison / reconciliation series, engineered or otherwise. I look forward to receiving any explainations that are forthcoming plus your comments. Cheers from Yorkshire.
I have watched the show and I will tell you something if Paul Senior talked to me like he talked to Jr., I wouldn’t stick around to be abused. I think the guy is a complete ass and glade to see that his sons are not talking to him for know, maybe he will learn his lesson before that bitch dies. Jr. you did nothing wrong you always wanted to start your own business so you did the right thing like I did and left your father in dust.
I live in the UK where the show is aired way behind the US. Would someone please explain what happened to Vinnie and some of the other regulars who seem to have departed. In addition, it is sad to see any family break-up least of all one so much in the public domain. There were times however, when I felt that the friction between the ‘Paul’s’ made more compelling viewing than the M/C that was the then current project. I, for one, would be sad if this ‘dynasty’ ceased to be. Perhaps there are more miles in a comparison / reconciliation series, engineered or otherwise. I look forward to receiving any explainations that are forthcoming plus your comments. Cheers from Yorkshire.
who really built,all those custom bike’s,if it wasn’t for Rick,Vinnie,Jim ,there wouldn’t be any,if you really watched the show,you see that Paul jr was a premadonna,taking credit for everyone else’s hard work,look what he’s done since leaving,a grill that looked better before he did it,his own logo,what a joke,and don;t get me started on Mickey,Sr’s carried those two clown’s for year’s,OCC’s building there best bike’s ever,sure SR’s rough around the edge’s,but if I ever talked back to my father like that I would have deserved a back hand maybe some day Paul jr will realize he’s just not that talented
who really built,all those custom bike’s,if it wasn’t for Rick,Vinnie,Jim ,there wouldn’t be any,if you really watched the show,you see that Paul jr was a premadonna,taking credit for everyone else’s hard work,look what he’s done since leaving,a grill that looked better before he did it,his own logo,what a joke,and don;t get me started on Mickey,Sr’s carried those two clown’s for year’s,OCC’s building there best bike’s ever,sure SR’s rough around the edge’s,but if I ever talked back to my father like that I would have deserved a back hand,maybe some day Paul jr will realize he’s just not that talented and quit trying to destroy what Sr and the the rest of the hard working emploee’s at OCC have accomplised
There’s enough blame here to gop around. I too am a recovering alki so I can pick Sr apart all day long. He’s a conrtol freak who treats his friends and dog with more repect than his kids. On the other hand, his kids were HANDED a golden opportunity that they can’t seem to just shut-up and put-up with the reality that Sr. is the Boss. Like it or not. I believe Sr AND Jr were equally as responsible for the success and/or failure of this. However, I too am a parent of adult children andI believe it is my resposibility to be an example,a leader, and the one to take the high roadwhen inevitable challenges come. Thats MY lifelong job as Dad!!!!! Sr has acted as if he were the child and failed miserabley here…
2 wrongs never make a right,
the both were wrong and crossed the line at some stage.
Paul Jr for being late and Paul senior for handling the situation.
I think it is all about Ego & Respect which is a lesson in life for all some learn it sooner some later some never
the end of the day blood is thicker.
Paul should work as a consultant and work on a per bike basis.
And Vini should be brought back and offered a senior full time consultant position which he deserved.
This will put back occ on the map and as a human , management consultant, values and the fact its never to late to make up may the set the lesson to others (cross my fingers)
As far as the court case goes its all ego.
Paul Seniors Wife isnt a good influence to him or good for him, she asked him to just go on his wedding day, i would have can called the wedding i dont think it suits her to leave anything for paul senior or mikey behind she has a few sons her self , every mans success there is a women and since married she has brought his downfall and dont think gives him good feed back nor do i think his current team at occ does kiss asses…
I totally agree with your post as to how the situation has deteriorated beyond recovery. It’s always a shame to see such pain.
BTW, please correct your spelling mistakes (there for their and son’s for sons), there’s no place for that in a lawyer’s post, even a biker lawyer’s.
From a boy from Oz who got a lot of pleasure from the show it’s just a shame. Ive been involved in a family surf business for nearly 20 years and at times it’s tough knowing what to leave at work and what you take home. from where i sit both Jr and Sr took advantage of each other clouding the family ties with work ties. Hope all works out behind the scenes because your a short time family and a long time dead. Catchya Willy and crew.
I quit watching this show the second season. Its the same ole sameo over and over. There all assholes, but Mostly for ratings. People stop to see the car crash! As far as business. The old man provided a outlet for some talented individuals to work. If the talented people think they could do it better, start your own business. Doing something and running a business are two separate things. I’ve seen many talented people that run businesses, but usually it suffers because its never the same as the person would build. Most of them would just rather work than run a business. The true businessman however may not have the mechanical skills, but knows how to market the product. This is a TV show that requires personalities and conflict. They need each other if they want the show to survive. Otherwise there just another custom bike shop.
The ‘artificial deadlines’ were stupid. no one ‘must have’ their motorcycle by a particular date – but it made for good television (although tiresome, tiresome, tiresome after repetition) and apparently bad blood.
cant belive that you are leving us aftre all the time we have been with you wot can i do to keep your show on the telly as i need you i dont take overdose when i watch you all please dont leave me now andrea jayne goodwin and wher can i mikey for presadant t shirt from love you loads
I have had some manufacturing knowledge of the S&S Cycle equipment used by OCC. You see I grew up in a screw machine shop with a father that was just like Paul Sr. Eventually I went out on my own and am much happier that way. At least my Dad and I talk. Paul Jr. you need to put the past and fame behind you and heal your family. Trust me I did.
occ was and will always be the best show on t.v.
sr and jr need to think about the fans who watched/bought merchandise etc and man-up, and start afresh or something if it does get totally cancelled it will be shocking
I love that show, I learned a lot just watching. I also get a head ache from the bickering! I am a businessman and I can vouch for the problems of having family for workers. They think they can have special privleges and you wont gripe. Life is just too short for that ‘biker’ ing, lol. I personally have way too much class to allow myself to live that way. I would need to know what is really on Paul Jr’s mind, to make a judgement on his actions, however, based on Norman’s vantage point, I agree that Paul Jr sh/have more respect for his father. No matter what your father does, you only have one and r-e-s-p-e-c-t is the name of the game for your father.
When Paul Jr was at OCC all the bikes were different, there were gimmicks, individual design touches. Now all they do is churn out the same old school hard tails, all that changes is the colour and the air cleaner.
There is no originality, nothing that made the bikes stand out. So they will not be making any more shows. Does Paul Sr think that he has made enough of an impact in the world to be remembered in 5 years time? That show was advertising that paid him rather than vice versa.
Companies came to him, knowing that their products would get global exposure and that by getting a bike from OCC they would become known all over the world for an hour of prime time. Try buying an hour of advertising for your company all over the world, then look at the cost of buying the bike.
Now that unique promotional tool has been taken away. Some businessman Senior is! Junior is using the show to promote his business and get some good contacts going. Senior seems to be concentrating on shutting them down.
Nothing much is made of the Ducati side anymore, is it still going? Nothing is being made of the California factory, has that ever been built? Can’t find anything about it.
Soon OCC will be like HD, and over bloated conglomerate nightmare with no customers. So sad…
If this show is real, Paul Sr. seems to have a a lot of hate for Paul Jr. I know Sr. built the business, and Jr. kind of slacks sometime, but Jr. did most of the good designs, and a father should not have that kind of hate against his son, Sr. is really an ass**** MOST of the time, and he was an alcoholic when the kids were growing up, so I think he needs to lighten up a bit. Just MHO
Faimly fueds sucks. but paul jr could not do right in his dads eyes!and to take your son to court thats wrong. an one thing paul jr bikes had more detail then now. hate to see this come to a end.but when faimly cant work thing out this is what happens ps get it together
Faimly fueds sucks. but paul jr could not do right in his dads eyes!and to take your son to court thats wrong. an one thing paul jr bikes had more detail then now. hate to see this come to a end.but when faimly cant work thing out this is what happens ps get it together
I was recently at OCC and I have to say it was JR’s bikes that showed creativity and was what everyone tuned into see. All the kids hate the old man and it goes alot further back. The old man had problems with booze and the family has alot of issues.Also it was the show that got alot of the endorsments.Let see what happens with the business without the show.
with all do repect to all,pual sr.get a life lightin up ,paul jr.made your com.what it is !we all watched it cause paul jr.has the best ideas,paul sr.should b proud of jr.from 1 newyorker 2 another.
i am a huge fan of the show. i am a woman 68 and very sick but i so enjoy family . you are a family and i do pray for happiness for all three of you to be togetherv again …..shirley a fan
Well i used to enjoy the program.
Senior should go back to the 12 steps program he forget to learn how to be humble.
Yup i’m an alki in recovery and senior acts like a dry drinker.
Jr whether right or wrong chooses his words carefully and is not judgemental.
I know who i would rather be 🙂
Be good all
Paul Sr has just enjoyed 25 years of sobriety.
He needs to remember what he put his family and kids through when he was a drinker.
TO THE HOT SHOT FERNADEZ ESQ. WHO STARTED ALL THIS NONSENSE…
YOU STATE YOU HAVE WATCHED THE SHOW I WONDER IF YOU EVER HAVE…
PAUL JR. WAS THE SAME FROM EPISODE ONE AS WAS TO THE END, HE DIDN’T START SLACKING OFF HE NEVER CAME IN ON HIS FATHERS TIMETABLE AND HE NEVER GOT LAZY, HE ALWAYS DID WHAT HE HAD TO AND HAD IT DONE WITH IMPOSSIBLE DEAD LINES ON TIME AND HE DID ALL HE DID WITH HIS ASSHOLE OF A FAHTER ON HIS BACK LIKE A DIRTY DIAPER.
AS FAR AS SR. BUSINESS SKILLS GO, UOI NEED TO OPEN YOU MIND A TAD BIT MORE AND LET A BIT OF REALITY SHINE IN.
IT WAS NEVER SR. BUSINESS SKILLS, HE BARELY HAS ANY, ALTHOUGH I WILL GIVE HIM THE CREDIT HE HAS FOR A STRONG WORK ETHIC, WHICH HE NO DOUBT OBTAINED IN THE MILITARY.
THEY BOTH CLAIM TO BE REPSONSIBLE FOR ALL THE SUCCESS BUT THE FACT IS, THEY WERE STRUCK BY LIGHTENING. IT WAS THE SHOW THAT BUILT THE BUSINESS, NOT THE OTHER WYA AROUND. AND THE FACT IS THE WERE NOT EVEN THE PRODUCERS FIRST CHOICE FOR HTE SHOW, HE WANTED A GUY BUILDING BIKES IN NEW HAMPSHIRE AND WHEN THE GUY BACKED OUT AT THE LAST MINTUE THE FOUND THE NEXT CLOSEST BIKE BUILDERS ON HIS LIST WHICH WERE THE TUTLES. IF HE DECIDED TO PUT YOU ON THE SHOW AS THE BUILDER THAN YOU WOULD BE RICH AND FAMOUS.
THEY ARE BOTH TO FULL OF PRIDE AND PIG HEADED TO KNOW THAT THE ARE NTOHING MORE THAN A COUPLE OF OVER GLORIFIED IRON WORKERS. NEITHER OF THEM ARE REPSONSEIBLE FOR THE DUMB LUCK THAT GOT THEIR LIVES TO WHERE THEY ARE, A PILE OF SHIT.
THAT REALITY ASIDE, WHAT SR. IS DOING BY SUING IS THE SAME DUMB ASS THING HE AHS DONE HIS WHOLE LIFE TRYING TO DESTROY EVERYTHING THAT EVER MEANT ANYTHING TO HIM. HE IS SERIOUSLY SICK IN HIS MIND.
REMEBER HOW HE WOULD ALWAYS LEAD THE SEEHOLE BRACADE TO DESTROY CARS AND BUILDING AND EVERYTHING HE WOUDL BUILD OR TOUCH? HE’S STILL DOING THE SAME THING. AND HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH HIS WIFE WILL BE NEXT.
I USED TO THINK THE ONLY ONE THAT BELIVED HIS FAT HEAD WHEN IT SPOKE WAS HIMSELF BUT APPARENTLY THERE IS YOU NOW AS WELL.
IF I WERE PUAL JR. I’D HIRE SOMEONE WITH THE MILLION DOLLARS TO SHOOT HIS EVIL DEMONIC FATHER IN THE HEAD. THE WHOLE WORLD WOULD BE BETTER OFF.
(MAYBE MIKEY WOULD DO IT).
This may sound like a selfish and jealous answer. But I personally know Paul senior. He worked as a sub-contractor for me as Pauls Welding and then as Orange County Iron works. He has let the money go to his head. I would like to think that I helped him many times when he and his detailers made huge mistakes on structural steel. I always made sure he was not at risk for loosing alot of money he did not have.
7 years ago when my son was dianoised with autism I called him seven times, wrote three letters and spoke to his son in the steel business to try and contact him. He was going to be 15 minutes from my home near the Catapillar plan in North Carolina. At the time I was desperate for research funds for my son. I was going to ask him to sign some hats that I would pay for and sell them to benifit my sons personal foundation.
Well Paul never returned calls or wrote back. He forgot where he comes from. He desreves to go broke and loose everything he has and maybe he will get back to basics. I hope someday he needs more help and know one is there to help him.
Writing irrational thoughts, and using ALL CAPS to presumably drive your point home, doesn’t make your post stand out; it makes you look like a freaking idiot.
I am a friend of Bill W. And as I have watched this show there have been numerous referances from Sr. about twelve step programs.I would suggest to Sr. that he get with his sponser or trusted friend and maybe do a 4th step on this relationship and own his part.We like to make others play the role we want, truth is we cannot control others. WORK IT OUT GUYS
I really think that Paul sr is an abnoctious Moron who demands respect but isnt willing to show anyone else any. Sure a son should respect his father but how could any reasonable person respect someone that thinks he is yhe only one that needs to be respected. The standard of bikes being put out since jr left are the same shit with a different colour . SR thinks he is the only reason that the buisness became successful but if not for Jr they would never have made it half as big as they have . Now Sr is trying to sue Jr, now that just shows what that dick head of a father he really is . I for one will no longer be watching that wanker anymore . The show is over as a ratings winner and i believe that OCC Choppers is basically finished . WELL DONE SR YA MORON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I myself think Sr. refused to give Jr. any credit for the sucess they achieved. Paul Jr. was treated by his father as an ordinary employee, instead of an outstanding engineer/creator (and partner) that he became. If I had been Paul Sr., I would have done ANYTHING to keep the sucess rolling. For such a smart business man (???)……he has destroyed a multi-million operation. His demand to “toe the line, and punch the time-clock”…..has cost him the show/his brother/his sons/and probably the OCC business. I guess Sr. has finally showed Jr. who is boss, huh ??
Sr. is like alot of folks from his generation. They worked hard for everything. Nothing came easy. And they almost despise someone who gets a lucky break, and a free ride to success. Sr. was bound and determined to not allow Jr. to bask in the sucess that was getting heaped upon them thru the American Choppers show. A smart father/businessman would have set his son down on a regular basis, and reminded him that a good work ethic was important to display to the rest of the OCC crew. Maybe he could have given Jr. an office to “mock-up” upcoming projects. Let him come in at 10 a.m., as a show of respect/achievement. Instead, he continually berated him in front of everyone. How worthwhile does that make the rest of the employees feel, if he treats his own son like an outcast dog ??
Lead by example (?) More like leading w/ an iron fist. I am sure Jr. would have been punched out many times, if Sr. were still drinking. And therein lies the root of the problem. Sr. quit drinking many years ago…and he no longer has a crutch to lean on when dealing with issues/problems in every day life.
I shared an identical situation with our family business, for 25 years. It has been a miserable, although sucessful experience. I could never put in enough time, get complimented, be rewarded as others, etc.
Be humble Sr., and get your family….and your life back. You are a big man, and can shoulder saying “you were wrong”. Everybody involved did wrong. Step up to the plate first, you are the “father” in this situation. All of you have enough money to be crazy-happy. Be smart, and share what time you have left……together.
I am watching a episode of OCC now and thought I would look at their web site and came across this blog
Geeeeee im devastated this is going on I really look forward to watching them everyday.
Just forgive forget and just get on with it .Life is too short to see family fighting over anything
Sr. was always rushing Jr. to get the job done . Jr. was and is an artist , not a production worker . Sr. thought Jr. should do bikes from dawn to dark , but Jr. wanted a life too . Money is easy to get and or raise , real talent is another story . Personally I think Sr. in his heart of hearts resented the fact his son had more talent than he did . Ask yourself this . If you were going to start a motorcycle company who would you hire Sr. or Jr. ?
TheReaper!
Sr, ass
Jr, Lazy Prima-Donna-ohh a grill
and a dog park, way to leave your mark
Mikey, lovable dumbass, get a job or clue
Fame by building one of a kind bikes, sustain through merchandising.
What is it with these reality shows?these company bosses have talented people working for them & all they do is bad mouth them whilst not doing a stroke themselves & when they do get involved they invariably lash it up & then blame whoevers standing closest,if i had the talent some of these guys have, i;de tell them where to shove there job & go to someone who respects me both as a person & for there talent i have in my chosen field wheather its paint, fabrication, design or whatever, only seen 1 series of chip fooses overhauling,now going by what you see on the tv here,s a guy who knows people,appreciates talent & lets them get on with there job, no bellyaching or shouting matches & turning out fantastic machinary.(is that why he left Boddington)? also people should look at the tv companies, giving thes guys impossible schedules & encouraging confrontation just for ratings.
I have a son just like paul jr. thinks the son shines out his ass always has always will, you notice how different mikey was treated by SR. I can see SR. asking pauly at 15 years old 47 times to simply clean up a mess he made after telling the brat 48 times any parent gets angry, just because your an artiste doesn’t give you the right to drag your ass into work whenever you please, just shows Paul’s kiss my ass attitude that sr. has had to put up with from day one with JR. plus every one of those bikes paul Designed are the same frame same pitch so he goes ok fellas on this one rickey will make a skull gas tank and vinnie will cut the same fender I always use, and our painter will make it fire engine red and oh yeah rickey make me something that looks like a ladder on the back, pauly couldn’t fab a gas tank to save his ass, or paint anything, he bent some rod to look like a spider web BFD ive seen that 500 times on choppers guys built in their garages in the 70’s
We need to remember the show had producers. Those people created the drama. For example, the build schedual that seemingly couldnt be met by these big time bike designers & businessmen. This created the tension & drama for the viewers.
The father was in the position of driving the son into building the very bikes he said he loved to build. If Jr needed that much direction he should have been fired long ago.
Sr talks to everyone like they are stupid & the result is anger. Why do it if its pisses you off that much?
Sr built a business & at the same time he built his kids. Those kids turned out like they are because Sr drove them to it.
They all act exactly as we expect N Jersey folks to act. Have you seen Jersey Shore? The situation? My god.
i have been watching the show for quite some time…..i love the bikes and the techniques used…am least bothered if when they fight …but the bike build should not affect cos of their fight..thats all i expect….
I think one of the biggest problems between Jr. and Sr. is that Senior became jealous of Junior’s talent.
Numerous episodes Paul Sr. would bad-mouth Paulie’s “ide-ers” and minimize his overall contribution to the company’s success. I think Paulie put up with a LOT of BS for a long time before blowing up.
Without Paulie, the show would have been a one-season wonder and Sr. would’ve been back building railings.
It’s human nature to press back against the pressure of constant short deadlines. The same self-destruction happened to Boyd Coddington’s operation on American Hot Rod.
Sr was the adult and seemed sincerely upset by the situation with his sons,but isn’t “wired” in a way to know how to fix it
Jr seemed to be responsable for the shows cancelation,as he announced it at the same time he announced his engagement, and was equally proud of each. This probaly propted the lawsuit,but woudn’t know without inside info.
Jr doesn’t seem to care about the situation as he is still only concerned with himself
Since Sr. can’t and Jr won’t ,Someone or something will have to interject to create reconcilliation.
I lost my dad suddenly on March 29, 2010. I always respected him, even though I didn’t always agree with him and never yelled at or fought with him. I can’t imagine how painful it would have been to lose him with the bitter feelings Mikey and Paul Jr. have towards Paul Sr. I’m telling you boys to swallow your pride and make amends with your dad while you can. You will regret it later if you don’t.
love dad while he is still here,cos after is too late,so what hes pig headed ,you will have kids one day and say well dad was right!.
listen boys,i lost my dad ten years ago and i still wish i could say things to him,when paul sr got angry when you guys came in late its cos he cared,cos he wants you to be better than he was at your age,and not make the same mistakes,the times you fellout before and he broke down,now i think he has had enough ,maybe he should have given you a small wage and treated you like employees.jr your girls got you round her little finger,wake up make up now before its too late.mikey must get these two back together and save this family,save the company save your selves .do it for grandma.the old mans looking really frail,i hope you guys dont live to regret what you are doing .i think senior would like nothing better than to leav the company to his boys,i am sure of that.
To this learned and well equipped viewer, I believe the penultimate moment of the entire “American Chopper” series was when the family burned out the yellow jacket nest. It was and still is the only intelligent act I have witnessed on that show. Paul Sr…you are a dry (or maybe wet) alcholic businees man who should probably just shoot yourself, “Jr”…go to college and really learn how to design, “Mikey”…you should probably just shoot yourself too.
if you didnt have the drama all these a- holes portray it wouldnt be on the tele maybe there faking the whole stupid thing who realy gives a fuck any how its television !!!not real life!!
I personally thought the whole fake bickering crap was boring and watch the show to see the cool bikes. Paul Sr was so fake and macho, kinda like Elvis trying to act in a movie, he could sing like a bird but act, I don’t think so. Anyway best of luck to the whole family. Someone posted here that life is to short for family’s to fight but money rules a lot of people and evidentially it ruled these people.
ok.If you have never dealt with an egomaniacal father then you will never understand . I started working with my father when I was 12 on the weekends . My father was a brick mason and very good . All that said , I was a labor and did all the crap work for 15 years having to deal with all the times when i put in ten hours a day only to be told the pay was putting my feet under my father ‘s table . We can sit back and arm chair quarterback this thing but untill you see the behind the scenes stuff over a lifetime you will never know all of what went on . I left the family in 2001 and became a truck driver . my oldest brother got the buisness and closed it in 2005 . i saw my dad 6 mos before he died of liver cancer . not for him but for me .I know this sounds selfish but i had issues to be resolved and came to the conclusion it was a mistake because with personalities like the one that paul sr and my dad share they never think anything they did was wrong . so while we can sit back and point fingers the truth is we dont know. and as to the insulting crap that the staff says about the kids, i would bet the bank they took that que from dear old dad. What i found in retrospect in my own situation is that men like this cant accept anyone who might be better than they are and will destroy anyone who is . This includes family .I feel for jr and mikey and hope for their own sanity they get help so they dont pass this on to the next generation , god help this family.
all i wanted to do was watch bike bilds i love bikes.but ther was the bickering and all the crap.it was if the bikes come last the crap first.how does a farther and son get to all this.ther was some good guys at occ.nubs his paint jobs well what can you say great.vinnie.ok mikey fun guy not in to bikes but thats mikey.an rick great guy all the guys who made occ what it was.then it all went down the pan.what is left to say.a new bike show yes but not occ.is all the crap comeing back.or will we see bikes well it is a bike show i think i have said all i can so lets just wait and see.L.B.M.from manchester england.22.june 2010.stay safe on your wheels guys and lades to.
I think its a shame,I never had a father around after the age of 5yrs.It sadens me to see two young men who have it so good and to be so blessed,to have a father that worked so hard,and yes he had some luck with him,but look what has happend, do to Paul srs. life!I beleave the chance he took in starting the steel buisness lead him to were he is now.Life is a chain event.How many times have you thought (IF I ONLY WOULD HAVE DONE THAT INSTEAD OF THIS??)From what I have seen I know most fathers have there a-hole times,but a good one never stops trying or loving and giving for his family.I think them two boys need to suck-it up & be more thank-ful.
LOVED THE SHOW,WISH IT WAS BACK. JR HAD A LOT OF INPUT AND WAS A VERY IMPORTANT TO THE COMPANY.SOMETIMES SR WOULD ARGUE OVER STUPID STUFF AND DID LITTLE TO BUILD BIKES.HE SHOULD HAVE STAYED IN HIS OFFICE AND LET JR RUN THE BUILDS.
Wow, what started as a quick news blurb has turned into an intervention. There are a few things that have to be remembered:
1- This is TV, it’s sole purpose is to sell products – advertising dollars drive the shows.
2- To sell products you have to have a compelling show that people will continue to watch – increasing the ratings – higher ratings means more advertising revenue. (and you thought they put these shows on for your entertainment)
3- They film countless hours just to get the 40 minutes that make up a one hour show. Therefore the producers show you what they want you to see – that which will make the most compelling or dramatic story, or create the most shock value. And the producers have never said that the show wasn’t scripted. (Go watch the filming of a “reality” show and see just how many takes they do to get the right shot)
4- Other than what is filed in the courts, we don’t actually know what is true and what was scripted. Making assumptions based on what you see on TV is, well, it’s just stupid.
5- Reality shows are lucky to last more than a year, much less the 6 that this show lasted. They were able to find success where others failed with a combination of drama, intrigue and talent, I only hope they planned for the eventual ending of the show. I truly wish everyone involved in this project the best in the future.
I worked for my father for 30 years and it’s not as easy as you’d think. You always get the jealously and resentment from people above you because they know in the end you’ll be eating dinner with the owner and letting him know anything they want to hide! Bottom line Jr. was cocky and arrogant sometimes, but he proved his heart was in the right place over and over and he had skills. It was SR who got too big for his britches and gambled on a huge building with no sense of the market conditions for loud expensive inefficient machines with no rear suspension! Jr certainty can see the future in motorcycling is not fat tire hard tail choppers! That’s business 101 folks and SR missed that call! Ouch! Having said all that I loved the show and wish they’d get back on track and let the new step mom stay in the kitchen and let the men run the business! My favorite bike was the POW bike! Bad ARSE!!!!
hi L.B.M.ther are plenty of things said about occ.it was a great show.sr had no respect jr.an the other way round.you earn respect.allthe dead lines must get to you.it was jr that was never late with one but sr still had to bad mouth jr all the time.i think vinnie had is fill of all the crap and left.cody must have had the same thing and went.we no what jr did.nubs did the best paint jobs that any man could do.and do we know who did a great job at makeing the best bike show go down the pan.well do we.o yes we do.i wil let you think about that one.so from L.B.M.25.june.2010.manchester england.stay safe on your wheels.
I think it was Jr’s designs that put Orange County Choppers on the map. My wife and I have watched the show from the very beginning. I really think Sr. is envious of Jr’s talent and it showed on almost every show and is still pretty obvious when Sr takes every opportunity to slam his son on TV. We really don’t see to much of that when they show Jr and Mikey. Almost all of the original cast is gone except for the old man. It really makes you think, and I also am sure that most, if not all his kids don’t want anything to do with their own Dad. The show just isn’t the same. I think Sr is the ego-maniac and he needs to put that in check for the show to continue.
I AM REALLY SORRY TO LEARN THAT PAUL JNR AND PAUL SNR HAVE FALLEN OUT, I LIVE IN ENGLAND AND WE HAVE ONLY JUST GOT THE PROGRAM ON AND IM HOOKED ALREADY, AS WE OWN A KAWASAKI Z1000 1980 THAT WAS ORIGANALLY FROM CALAFORNIA, I HOPE THEY PUT THEIR DIFFRENCES ASIDE AND CALL A TRUCE, FOR ALL THEIR SAKES. I MUST ADMIT PAUL JNR HAS SOME AWESOME IDEAS FOR THE BIKES. THE COMPANY REALLY NEEDS HIM.
Alan you are right. It’s too bad they cannot get their shit together. I feel that the son should respect the father. Trouble is that Jr. treats his dad like a partner instead of a dad. I would never treat my dad like that.
Norm
I have it set up to record on my digital video recorder. I can then watch it at my leisure. The show is better than most crap on TV, at least it is interesting.
Norm
Well I am hitched. Thanks for the comment with many facts to respond to 🙂 Yes I had a great bachelor party. My dad was able to make it, my sister picked him up from the nursing home with a foldable wheelchair. He even stood up and said a few words. I will post another article about the wedding with some pics! Most of the pics I have over the past 9 years were taken by Elizabeth believe it or not. She would make the great photographer. We are taking a cruise to Hawaii for our honeymoon; however we have to delay it a month or two because of her law school. Stay tuned for the article Sandy.
Norm
Norman I just heard today that this Thursday there will be a major announcement on American Chopper and that it will be the last show for the series. To be frank, Orange County Choppers made a name for itself on the TV show, and it may not survive without the TV show.
It was an interesting show.
Norm
I never hope that anyone fails. The way I see it what you hope bad on someone else comes back on you; god works in mysterious ways.
With that being said, I don’t think the corporations are going to pay for special construction motorcycles if they are not going to be featured on TV anymore.
I think the TV show was a major reason for the success of OCC but I could be wrong.
There would have been no OCC without Paul Sr., it was his money and expertise that got the company started. It could be argued that Paul Jr.’s designs are what made them successful. In the end, they self destructed. Too bad.
Norm
Well Vinnie and Cody left and opened their own shop called V-Force Customs, check here: http://www.autoblog.com/2008/02/11/vinnie-and-cody-from-occ-create-their-own-custom-bike-company/
and here: http://www.vforcecustoms.com/
Norm
For most of my articles I use Dragon Dictate to dictate the articles into text. Sometimes the software makes basic mistakes like you found. Unfortunately sometimes I do not catch all of the typos. Thanks for letting me know.
Norm
In humble opinion, the family feud killed the show and most likely the business. The fame and fortune go to to all of their heads.
In any case, they made more money then all of us probably ever will so I don’t feel too sorry for them.
Norm
Well BigTee I am no hotshot, and I have not started shit. I did write an article about the Teutul’s above. I disagree with some of your opinions. You started making sense until you went off into a diatribe about a son shooting his father, that is a friggen insane approach to the situation.
I don’t know about you, but I did not have a rich daddy that gave me jobs and money for school; I was in the Air Force at the age of 17 instead of going to 12th grade. I took the GED instead.
Anything I have gotten in my life was all on my own.
When I hear people crying for Paul Jr. or Mikey, each of which have huge houses and bunches of money, it is easy for me to keep things in prospective.
Norm
Joe I have to disagree. I would bring in the business man first no matter what. Money is not easy to raise or get. Talent is a dime a dozen if you have the money. With money you can hire any talent you need. Without the businessman nobody would ever know you.
Norm
Mr Fernandez,
Paul Teutul jr has issues with Paul sr that go back to his childhood.Valid issues!This dispute isn’t really about money or who designed or managed what.It’s about two people admitting how they really feel about each other,too bad it’s father and son.
Maybe Paul jr could apologize to his father for some of the things he’s said and done.Maybe Paul sr should show his son some acknowledgment and tell him he loves him no matter what.I don’t think Senior has it in him.
You’re really more about numbers and business Mr Fernandez and less about feelings and emotions!
GOD BLESS AMERICA.take care and beware..
IN THE EPISODE I WATCHED PAUL SR GAVE ONE MEMBER OF HIS STAFF RICK TO DESIGN HIS OWN BIKE & BUILD IT THEN HE STARTED TO COMPLAIN HE DID NOT LIKE IT INSTEAD OF LEAVING IT TO RICK AND HIS SONS?AS I AM A OLD SCHOOL BIKER I SEE RICK DESIGNED & BUILT A GREAT BIKE,WELL DONE RICK,MIKE&PAUL JR
I think Paul Jr. did the right thing, leaving his useless dad. Why? I watched the Liberty Bike episode last night, and Paul Sr. gave a comment of “I am going to do what I do best, supervise”. Yea that sums it up, you trash talk the crap out of your son on that episode, where are the parts to this bike, you never do things right. what were you doing all day? Kicking your feet up and relaxing. Worrying about your dumb dog all day. Vinny, Cody, Pauly, Mikey, etc. all left because of you. Just like above, you trash talk your son on National TV, you are a bad example of a father. Pauly made OCC, not you, just like the face offs before, Pauly will always win. Without the OCC employees you would be nothing. They are only there for a paycheck buddy.
To the writer of this article, you have no clue on how a business runs. We as the consumers follow the work of the designer, for quality, style, expertise, craftsmanship, etc. Just like the Bugatti Veyron, the top designer is now working for Audi, just by knowing this I would probably buy one as this person is just like Pauly. A business is not only about the way it is ran. And by the way, Paul Sr. isn’t the one that built OCC to the way it is, we can thank Ron Salsbury, and Steve Moreau for that.
According to Paul Sr. “I just want to Supervise”, yea you just do that buddy. Sit in your office all day, you and your idears, and your uh’s every 2 words you speak.
Thank you
Love your show, Hope Paul JR comes to his senses and apologizes to the old man.
im not sure if sr or jr read the coments but ive been a fan of the show and abilitys but more so the gift and opertunity that sr has had and was given and has given for his family woking with family can be hard but is this what happins when you achieve in buisiness you begain to fail in family id rather be broke than broken losing a family member can be life altewring but giving them up can be like deth (before ahnore comes humility
I loved the OCC show and always looked forward to the next episode. It was not the same without Jr, Mikey and the usual gang. I agree 100% with the comment left by WES. The kids went thru hell from a very young age and the whole family dynamic is disfunctional. They have been thru counselling etc. but the past wounds are sometimes too deep and when your own flesh and blood turns on you..how does one fix that? Jr. and Mikey need to do whatever they feel they must to live a happy life and if that means being apart from their abusive dad, then so be it. All a kid ever wants is to feel that their parents are proud of them no matter how they turn out. I think Sr. will live to regret the decisions he has made. RIP OCC.
Sr thinks he knows it all and treats his son like crap, neither of them seem to appreciate each other at all. Jr needs to learn what it is like to run a business to see his fathers side of things in the real world you just can’t show up when you dang well please or the other things he did while working with his Dad. I also hope Sr will see how good is son is doing and acknowlege it also I honestly don’t see that happening.
I think the reason vinny left was because he was always gone from home on theose tours and he has three girls to raise as well as a lovable wife. he wanted to start his own business and be able to work his own hours. I do believe he is happy now and I doubt he had any hard feelings towrds OCC. He does have a websigt for his bikes, called V-Force Customs. Check it out.
The way I see it is that paul jr. is the backbone of the designs. sr. spends entirely too much time yelling and complaining about coffee cups. I do not think paul jr should have to give up his stock. If not for him the entire business would not be what it is. Anyone that thinks paul jr slacks off and wastes time should take into consideration that creativity is not something that can be put on a schedule. I understand that sr. is the business end of the shop, But take into consideration that running a profitable operation also depends on how you treat your employees even if they are family. People are only going to take so much crap. Paul jr. has five time the talent to design bikes that sr. has. and sr. does not appreciate the dedication jr has given. Jr, I am behind you all the way, Do you stuff.
I wanted to tell Paul Sr. that he is not much of a father to his children. He is still playing a tough guy role that he has always had. A real ASSHOLE
He uses the role to discise his many issues. What is really sad is that Paul Jr. is just like his father. Sad world…….
This is a classic example of greedy, egotistical people thinking that they have a contract for life. Tomorrow is promised to no one, Walter Payton said this and it’s a fact. One day it ends, everything is temporary. This father and son team seems to think that their situation is unique and they have all the time in the world to work this out or see how long they can hold each other off in this Mexican Standoff.. The 3 amigos need to wake up tomorrow and realize that they had a great run, made some dough and now need to enjoy their lives. Not too many father and sons teams get this opportunity in life. WAKE UP idiots and enjoy the few years you have together before it’s too late!
I think the fact that Sr. doesn’t have a relationship with any of his children answers the question as to who has the real issues in that family. NONE of his kids talk to him, before you remove the straw from anothers eye remove the rafter from your own Sr.
Sr (or respectively )Paul Sr. You Sir need a squeeze ball you relax your tensions. The show I believe, is showing how well Paul Jr. can orchestrate how well he can relax his side of bike building can be. You Sr, are going in for a noise dive soon BUT WAY TO SOON. The TWO of you can show OLD school with the New school technology. With all the upgrades out there You Sr. could REALLY step up to the plate to build ONE together. I know it has been said a million times on this site but it is TRUE ease up a notch. Then your GRUPPY old self will be liked a little more, what a concept Mr Paul Tuttle Sr. Good luck on the new Season and to MORE to come.
I wish I could be sure to watch more but well my time is near the end and so this is why I tell you now how I feel
Just my opinion-I watch the show because I do some metal fabbing as a hobby.Today I saw first show without Paul jr. and it was great.I like jr but
his attitude and all the arguing with his father is shameful.I got divorced three times because I dont like arguing.
It be-littles a person.Paul Sr. seems a lot more happy not arguing with a smart a.Show is better to watch without jr.If his attitude changes -maybe-.I will be quitting to watch if show is going to be fussing/arguing,dis-respectful all the time.Then it is just another one of those stupid sit-com
Its really sad seeing dad and son not getting along .. they have different ideas and methods but i hate to have my dad on my a** all day and i feel Jr’s . mr Paul senior should have laid back a little and not just go grab the money . his son creates masterpieces and its sad to see all of their efforts go down the drain …. O.C.C
Does anyone know the REAL reason Vinnie left OCC, and is he still friends with Paul Jnr and Mikey
So very sad to see any family at each others throats,but I feel this was inevitable for the Teutals, Paul snr comes across to me as an arrogant loutish bully,Paul jnr as a big headed prima donna, and as for Mikey he appears to be a childish, bone idol, spoilt wanker, So I think that for such a totally dysfunctional family to stick to-gether would be an impossibility, As for the TV series,If you have seen one youve seen them all,I hope Vinny and Cody have success in their new ventures, in my view they contributed most of the input to actually building the bikes than any of the family, all THEY seem to say is ” GEE THATS AWSOME” what an awful shower of dickheads they are, they all deserve to go bankrupt,
Please, Paul Sr. has got to be the worst example of fatherhood I have ever seen. Additionally, as a boss, someone who is suppose to emulate appropriate behaviour, his actions are disgusting. The language, the outbursts, the temper tantrums. He complains about his sons but his sons and their behaviour but they are not doing anything that he has not done. I guess he is a believer in “Do as I say, not as I do”. But that is a load of crap.
I enjoyed watching the early shows but the constant fighting was getting old. I think that Sr. has anger issues that he needs to get help with. Jr is totally irresponsible. If he were just another employee he would have been fired years ago. No company can tolerate such behavior as it can spread throughout the company. Both father and son are at fault. They know it but are to stubborn to back down. The company will fail as a result. They are blowing a good thing.
from watching the,re-runs.sr definitely
has some mental,problems. watch micky,as
he gets mad over,nothing too.he has the
same gene.jr holds it in till,look out!
its to bad,great show,sr needs to get rid,
of that,me me me,he will stroke out,for sure!
Paul Sr is a user and a loser. The first chopper built in his iron shop was done by one of his best friends Mike R. who was part of the first show, but did fit in with the show’s father son fighting. Senior lost all of his close friends because money came first, and now he lost his kids too…
Hi, my name is Tracy i am 53 years old.
x-marine this is were i was trinded to get along with others..i hope this don,t
don’t get out of hand..family is every thing pleace don’t blow it. my father lost 8-sons and 5-=girls.
it’s not fun…
May GOD bless you all..
Paul Sr. should try to be a father and not a control freak. He needs to go turn on his television , turn to the discovery channel and watch the deadliest catch. and see what a good father and beautiful person Captain Phil Harris was. maybe Paul Sr. can learn something about fatherhood. He needs to put his big ego to bed.
Hey Paul Jr.
Just want you to know that you will be the best bike builder ever. I see you and vinnie work and how paticular you are. Its great that you take extensive pride in what you do. Also I have a dad alot like yours and because of his attitude towards mom and and us kids we have no communication with him because of choice. You are an awesume young man keep on doing what you do. I love to ride and have a custom vw trike which my wife and I with the help of friends built.
God bless
Byron.
I don’t think a father or son should disrepect each other like they do. Sr. says he does everything at the shop. It’s he holds it together but Jr. is the one that people tune in to see what he’s done next. I just wounder how things were before they had the show. Someone said Jrs. head got to big because of the show but i think it got to both there heads. Iwould never disrepect my dad like that but my dad would never disrepect his son like sr. does either. And now there going to have them competing agaist each other. TLC dosn’t care it’s all about ratings
Hey, I am shocked, since I just saw the first episode of season 6 and Paul Jr. got fired, I am from Germany and there we also could see the show in the TV, it was always cool to watch the guys fight and stuff, but that it goes so far I have not thinked, I am more or less in the same situation, I work in my father company and my dad can be like Paul Sr. like shout, throw stuff around ( Cell Phones, Tools etc.) but there must always be a way to work together, first he is my dad but he is also my boss, and if we have a fight it’s not in the TV and lucky not in front of the other employees but I know how hard it is to meet the expectations of your dad if you work for him, I wish them all the best and that there might be a chance that they come back together. But as well as others have said, I think the fame is going both a little to their heads, I think that’s a fact.
I agree with that guy Bill earlier, Paul Sr ran his whole family off, said his girlfriends family are his family now, so he’s the one that needs to apologize to all his family. I agree that Paul Jr, slacked alot of the time, later in the shows, but he was the one that helped keep his fathers business going with his designs. I think Sr was totally wrong in kicking Mickey out, he was the one always trying to keep the peace in the family. Sr is a total jackass in my opinion and he needs to step to the plate and show amends since he is the father. It’s sad that things are the way they are now. Paul Sr i think just has a big head and now its down to being against his whole family.
WOW… I agree…Love the show, it is very entertaining, and educating…I think the BIG HEADS need to get over it, if that is what is really causing the probs. They are family, and need to re-realize that, say sorry, cause you never get family from anyone else..May GOD Bless them all, and I hope they get back together where OCC really needs to be… Love YA…..
I think Paul Sr. did the best he could. But At some point need to reconcile with his sons. The poeple that surounds him now are a bunch of yes men. Except one and everyone know who that is. I just think that the show and eventually the co. will lose it popularity with out the core group. p.s. I could’nt help but to feel sorry for mikie when they didn’t take him on that last trip. Notice how everyone was asking for the sons. Get ride of the yes men. Good Luck
i realy love occ,i cant wait for tha new show,i think jr will realy show his father that he has learned everything sr tought him and has surpassed him in building bikes.i just hope this show will bring them back together as a family.
Well they fell out! it was a long time coming,I watched as i want to see bikes being built not a father and son fight every time it was on air,got fed up with hearing Awesome every five minutes as for the bikes, sorry but thought some of them looked awful and over priced! as for the real talent that went to Vinnie and Rick, without them OCC would be nothing,
I have read alot of post here and agree with the fact that, in my opinion Paul Sr. is a big headed ego driven asswipe that loves his fame more than his own sons. Unfortunately, it is over and now starting to get old news. All we as fans of the show can do is watch reruns and maybe a new series (I have heard rumors of something call OCC vs Paul Jr. Designs), Paul JR. has started his own motorcycle building business since the no compete clause has expired, and somekind of new series is supposed to be in the works…now that will be interesting to watch.
At any rate, I think that in the lawsuit between JR. and Sr. I hope that JR. bends Sr. over and crams it straight up his ass,maybe that would help Sr. to lose a little bit of his ego. Nuf said
To make along story short as a father and son i see no real love here. Only real love is through Jesus Christ and thats bottom line, you can cast your stones and shout all you want but bottom line its the Love of Jesus Christ.
Money is not the root of all evil
Its the love of money.
1 Timothy 6:10
For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.
NO JESUS NO PEACE!
Well said! Amen
I know for a fact that Paul JR. was a big reason for the success of the shop and the show. Yes, Paul SR. started the ship but it was the designs (and the arguing) that made the them successful.
If they would both just admit to how each contributed to the shops success then maybe all would be well. I think JR. just wants his pop to say “nice job son”.
I know that they both have a New York ego but when it comes to family nothing else should matter.
FORGET ALL THE BULLSHIT, SELL THE COMPANY AND LET RIDE!!
I live in the UK and love this show, I thought that Paul Sr and Pauly made the show and when they argued i thought it was just for ratings, I am dissapointed that Farther and son have fell out with one an other and do hope that they resolve the situation soon. You only live once and it dosent matter how much money you have! Family comes first, I wish them all the luck in the world Jimmy NBT.
Paul jr is clearly the soul of the OCC legacy. While Sr is no doubt a great rail man, and yes probably the $ behind the start of OCC it would have never made the grade it did without Jr.. Jr’s creative side is where the real rubber hit the road, it wasnt Sr’s work ethic, it wasnt a butt load of his money, it wasnt his creative genius.
The shop they started was already in place for the rail business, and if anyone knows a couple lifts was probably all the original investment required as any scooter tramp ( and Sr seems to think he is original sled dog material ( i see another yuppie that may have had a sled as a kid)) worth his weight would have a complete shop available as a daily requirement. The rail business is a metal fab shop which is about all you need when starting out. They were buying frames and motors, and everything else they needed where the key to the success lay is in Paul Jr’s vision and the skills his dad gave him growing up.
Jr has an eye for unique, he can visualize what he wants something to be and then deliver on it. While his dad may have inspired his ability there is no one but Pauly that can take credit for his vision, his desire and his drive. Sure he strikes some as lazy, but you show me an artist or someone who has a position in which creativity is a must and i’ll show you someone who has to take time doing things that inspire the visions, if its staying up late and drinking beer hangin with the bro’s that free’s his mind, then you can bet your ass that id be footin the bill as long as he kept delivering.
Paul Sr and his on time, work-aholic point of view are old school and in the rail business a great thing. In the creative mind it can be and spell the end, and in this case it did.
Pauly showed up late, but when the deadline was there the man would work 3 days straight to accomplish a finished product that is the backbone and soul of OCC and obviously what the public wanted, I think Sr is the one who needs to do a lil ass smoochin and WTFU!
Now all you candy assed paper pushers can tell me im wrong, but im the one with a metal fab shop and 3 sleds in the shop all built by my hand. I know what is and what aint, a lot of ya’ll are lackin back bone and its apparent because all i see above is people on the whine about how their daddy was so mean to them… get the f*&( over it thats what dads do… its the job requirements.
Agree, with U. I feel sorry for the Occ guys. All that money and a shitty family situation. Not worth a damn in my mind. Sr. doesn’t seem to understand his sons, he really needs to work on making amends with his family.
Look at my other article on the subject. The show was cancelled unexpectedly. However they are supposed to be bringing it back in a different form.
Norm
I THINK ONE OF THE BEST SHOW’S ON TV! BUT PAUL SR DOES LOSE HIS TEMPER FOR NO GOOD REASON. I THINK THAT’S WHY HE LOST VINNY AND PAUL JR @ MICKEY. IS THE SHOW GOING TO BE ON IN 2010 ?
its a sad moment when father and son have thast sort of disagreement…I love my son–he is my best friend–he would give his life for me and I for him….we have not always seen eye to eye..and Im sure there are times when I disciplined him that he wopuld have liked to kick the crap out of me..but in the long run he finally said to me “Dad..I know why now!”.
I recently lost everything…retirement money..house..cars…to the eveil enities at medicaid that decided I should pay them for the medical treatment my Grandaughter recieved while she was alive…(she was disabled and I adopted her from “my other son” who is a selfish-evil child beating bastard and was the reason she was disabled….no warning no hello- screw you- or anything I woke up the day after she died to notification that everything had been siezed…If it had not been for My Good son..I would not have a roof over my head or a place to lay my head safe from the elements…
so I know howit is..my heart goes out to the Tuttels I hope they reconcile and realize that blood is much thicker than water and more lasting than money
I have watched the show for many years and have enjoyed it. Family is very important. Unfortunately Paul SR & JR have forgotten this. It doesn’t hurt to sit down with your parents and talk over any disputes that you have,and try to settle any disagreements. Life is too short and as human beings some of us have frailities and large egos. It takes a big person to admit that he or she is wrong.I miss Mikey who bought laughter into the business. I hope Paul SR & JR family the best,and hope they work out their differences. Perhaps they were better off poor then wealthy.
My wife and I have watched the show from the begining and have really enjoyed it for the most part. Even though Jr. was tardy sometimes he was the artistic force behind the company. I understand Sr. had to run the company, and there are deadlines to be met, you can’t force creativity. Especially when you are creating one-off bikes. Basically I think Sr. is an ass*$&^ and I couldn’t work for him for 5 minutes so I don’t blame Jr., Vinnie or Cody for leaving. Sr. is not a very good bike builder and that is very evident when you see him try and build something from the ground up. He used to push Jr. but on his worst day Jr. was faster than Sr. Sr. had aspirations of building the company into some kind of global powerhouse but they got too big too fast and in this economy, and without Jr., they are screwed. We don’t enjoy the show without Jr. and really don’t watch it anymore.
I was a fan of the show since the beginning. However I hated the bickering between Sr & Jr and I often switched channels so I didn’t have to watch it. I realize this is reality TV and producers went out of their way to capture the fights as it must sell same as crashes do at Nascar races. I feel Jr was big headed jerk that felt as long as job got done he could come and go as he pleased. Wrong when you work for somebody else, you follow the rules as other employees must do. Yes Sr gets credit for starting the company but his management skills could be done better by some 2nd graders. Without TV show this company will go up in flames. It is only a matter of time in this economy. I really hate to see this happen but I don’t feel they can turn around the facts to save the company.
I just started watching the OCC. I had no idea what I was in for.The master craftmenship to the drama! Wow…it is intense. In my opinion I think they all have a talent. Combined they are a power source. Alone…not soooo much! Overall, I love the show and will turn on my TV today as I do everyday to catch up on the series to get ready for the new one!
(or if for anything to support Vinnie…haha!)
I have watched this show for its entire run and still watch the reruns to this day. I just dont understand why Paul SR need to be such a jackass. Those guys both do have egos but SR thinks the world revolves around him and that no one else knows what they are doing. Every time he would go off on Paul and then get involved in building the bike he would screw it up. I am sure he had his glory days but it is time to pass the reigns over to his sons and let them keep the legacy going.. It would be one thing if it was just JR that had left but look at the past. Vinnie left who was about as good as they get. Rick has now left them as well so if you had any sort of common sense at all wouldn’t you say to yourself that ” hey wait a minute here maybe I do have a problem” ? They all have so much to be thankful for and more money than they know what to do with but he has ostracized everyone in his immediate family. Three sons and a daughter that hate your guts. Is that really how you want to go to the grave knowing this. Hope they get things straighten out because his health and the rage he has he could go at anytime..
Just like Jeff D, I have watched the show since it’s inception and still to this day watch the reruns. I have to say that I know that Jr disrespected his father by loafing and not being on time and the like but Sr was and still is the problem. To me, OCC is still being successful at putting out choppers and they are very nice but they aren’t nearly as creative and don’t have as much going on as they were when Jr was working there. I can’t understand how it seems to be nearly impossible for Sr to give anyone other than himself credit for the success of the company. Several people in this blog have contended that they feel like the Jr and Mikey should eat crow and apologize because they’ll only have one father the that street goes two ways and I believe it’s more Sr’s doing then it is the boys. I do agree that Sr has some business savy and deserves a lot of credit because of his gamble to start OCC and also to run the business successfully but Jr is the true creative genius behind the “theme” bikes because the only thing that Sr did during those builds was to scream and disrupt and threaten to stick his “size 12’s” up someone’s back side. In true OCC style, you don’t have to agree with me but you’d be wrong if you don’t!!!!
I have still one question that I don’t have a real answer. Why Paul Sr. does no longer have relationship with all his sons. Mickey was no bad. He was part of the show not very useful I have to admit but part of the show. Why his relationship with his father stopped as well. Mickey and Paul Jr. are still together. Paul Sr. third son has no longer relationship with Paul Sr. as well but he has nice contact with his 2 other brothers.
Don’t you think Paul Sr that pushed away his 3 sons may be the cause of the problem. How someone can be right and pushed away not one but 3 of his sons.
My $.02
fantastic show fantastic bikes.what a shame its come to this
steve
united kingdom
HI L.B.M.some good points by FACT aug 2.2010.why did he have a bad relationship with is sons.i wonder if he knows. he did not have respect for any one. you have to earn respect but snr does not see it that way.he is to full of him self.as you say mickey is a good guy and the first to say bikes are not his thing.he was not that great with vinnie and he is a great bike builder.paul snr likes money better than people.that is just the way i see it.so from me l.b.m.stay safe on your wheels FACT.aug.3.2010.manchester england.
I agree completely. Business is business and I am the President of Superior Insurance. The top sales person of a company aka. top earner for the company is rarely the CEO. I think Sr was right and has to live with the outcome. He will do just fine. Everybody is replacible. Paul Jr. is going to finally be what he always wanted, his own boss. It takes more the being an extremly skilled craftman to succeed in business but because of the fame and exposure he gain from his time in his fathers company, he should go far. I do beleive in 5 years he will respect his father a lot more
I think that they need to suck up there feelings and make peace with eachother life is to short to act this way how would either one of them feel if one of them died then what? how are you going to feel then its a real shame you can pick your friends but not your family at the end of the day family is all you got and money means nothing if money means more to you then family you dont deserve anybody you deserve to be misrable,lonely,and unhappy if i ever talked to my dad the way paul jr. talks to his dad i wouldnt have any teeth my dad would knock me into next week thats the truth a little argueing never hurt anyone it should make you have a stronger bond with your family im 22 years old maybe i dont know what im talking about but thats how i feel. thankyou
This is the type of relationship that I have seen personally. I have worked for someone who ran off every employee they’ve ever had, FIRED, FORCED RESIGNATIONS, the whole nine yards. These “employers” have of course put a lot of money into their businesses, but, they have forgotten that they did not build the entire “empire” on their own. These owners hire people that they know can build their business and make them money, once they have bled that person and taken enough of their ideas and creations… They ditch them. they have provided a place,and stood on he shoulders of OTHERS to get them to the next level. Nine times out of ten, the money slows down, and the employer, (father), tries to reel the family, or TALENT, back in to rebuild his bank account. Only to do it all over again down the road. A truly self-centered individual…
I dont know what occ youve been watching but in my opinion paul SR. is the bigest drama queen ive ever seen. He gets bent out of shape over the most trivial things and without paul Junior occ is going to colapse.
Paul sr. your a dick! I have been divorced twice and my three daughters are my world.I watch your show every day,and the only reason is because of your kid’s!Wake the f— up and turn it around!It is not to late.You might have twenty years left in life, enjoy the fortune you have made with your kid’s,who made you what you are today.Good luck maybe we will one day meet and i will shake your hand for making the right decision!Pull your head out of your a–!
Without Paul Sr. there would not be orange county choppers he,s a ass hole some times but look how he even treats is employees taking them some wear paying the bill b.b.q etc etc Paul junior,s head is too big he needs to grow up and go back to work and WHEN his DAD is being a asshole he should have respect to his father and shut up !! and then every one can go back doing what they do best/ building bikes and entertaining us !!
Hard to believe Paul Sr. ruined a great Company.
The truth to the matter is Sr. is Jealous of Jr’s Building talent and Jr. was the Star of the Show.
Jr. has serious talent and built all those special Bikes that made the Millions for the Company.
Jr. deserves to arrive to work whenever he wants because he is the Star, master bike builder and most important his Son.
The way Sr. “Rides” the workers, “Is it done yet”?
“Is that all you got done”? who would want to work for a Boss like that?
Paul Jr.’s time is worth at least 4.00 a minute or 240.00 an hour as a master bike builder.
If Rick is making less than 60.00 an hour he is under-paid. Rick is a master now and deserves a good wage. A buck a minute is fair for a guy building Bikes with a 12.00 a minute profit margin.
Sr. is a poor father and he would not have that business today if it was not for Jr. & even Mikey.
Mikey may not be a master builder, but he is always there to do what needed to be done.
I watched an episode today where Sr. was yelling at Jr. for using his Grinder. Who Cares? It’s his son and he is building a bike for the same company?
All my tools are available for any family member, no problem. If they break, no problem, I can buy another.
If Sr. was smart he would stay home and let Jr. make the Company into a Giant.
The problem is Sr.’s ego is so big, even bigger than his head.
Who cares if Jr. comes in late, he worked many a late night finishing jobs. Jr. is the real Star and master builder.
Vinny was very smart to leave the Company, now he can build 2-3 Bikes a quarter and make 10 times the money he got from OCC. I bet Vinny got a measly 14.00 and hour or so.
that’s bull shit Jealousy my ass
Everyone just an F.Y.I., the new American Chopper, Sr. vs. Jr. is supposed to air this week.
You got to admit, this whole thing could have been a set up, but either way, both of these guys are businessmen. They got a whole new show that will probably be more popular than their last show.
In the end, they will probably both be making more than any of us!
Norm
I do not know what program you were watching,but the program I watched was a father who treated everybody incuding his two sons like shit.He is so jealous of his sons ability,he cannot stand it.Good old dad should crawl to his sons and beg for forgiveness.I never saw or heard of a so called dad that treated his family as bad as he has.If you watched the new show,he tried to put his son down as much as he could,with the people that work for him.I never once heard jr say one bad word about his so called dad.I think you might have something to do with OCC.or you would not be taking up for that so called dad.
I used to like the show but got tired of all the fighting and bickering. I think the producers of the show instigated some of it. However, if you look back at the history of Paul Sr., you’ll realize that he’s never been a family man. Early on, he sold his metal fabricating business to his third son. There ended up being lawsuits involved and the third son (Dan?) and Paul Sr. didn’t talk to each other for years. After watching the first episode tonight of the new season, and seeing how Paul Sr. bad-mouthed and made fun of both Paul Jr and Mikey, I hope OCC goes bust. The only one left there with any talent is Rick. Also, I just don’t think Paul Jr has the business acumen or work ethic to make it on his own. I think we may be seeing the last season of OCC.
Written in the script for the series or actual family
business publicized, Paul Sr. made it all happen. Period. Ungrateful, spoiled and egotistical sons say Paul Sr. is a far better businessman than a mentor to his kids. So what. He has the only track record of success in the whole mix.
Show some friggin’ acknowledgment to your Dad you two
friggin’ honyocks. Both these sons could use a good old fashioned job hunt.
If Junior doesn’t have the work ethic or business skills that’s his problem not Senior’s.
All Senior has to do is buy Junior out of his 20% interest in OCC and let his son go, but Senior is trying to manipulate his way out of it.WHY?? Because Senior does not want the competition that close to him.
If Junior doesn’t have the work ethic or business sense what does Senior have to worry about?
Been there and done that, designer, chief engineer, plant manager, and had my own manufacturing shops, with in house engineers, salespeople, and high skilled labor.
Paul Sr. made what I would think is a fairly easy slide into the custom bike world from his fabricating business. He had background, building, facilities, equipment, and material connections. He started out small as a sideline business, with the major business as his means of support. A nice way to get started.
Granted he may have entrepreneur skills, and some design skills, but this only goes so far. He lacks really good management skills. and most of all the artful design skills that Paul Jr. obviously has acquired, coupled with his fabricating skills. To have the vision to come up with designs like Paul Jr. is a gift that he has perfected. Paul Sr. lacks this real quality. Paul Sr. appears to realize this and many times seems to antagonize Paul Jr. just to attempt to make himself look important, only to come away looking the fool.
Now that Paul Sr. has the design computer he feels he is able to equal Paul Jr’s skill, which may come back as a bite in the old mans ass. With his head all swelled and his new computer he is even more disrespectful of Paul Jr’s inherent skills.
Paul Sr. lacks really good management skills when it comes to employees. Which he exhibits daily by exhorting an employee in front of his whole shop personnel. Playing Mr. Macho man is not a good management skill, especially when coupled with threats. He should leave this kind of mentality for the members of biker gangs, it has no place when one wants to create a good work environment.
I don’t agree with Norman Fernandez statement that designers are dime a dozen, lawyers are two dimes a dozen. Good designers, like GOOD lawyers are not dime a dozen, this statement has no place in this discussion in my opinion.
A lot has been said about Paul Jr’s disrespect for his father, however respect should be shown to a son also, it is a two way street. When you consider all the petty criticism, and public tongue lashing Paul Jr. has endured over the years from his father, I don’t blame Paul Jr. for bailing out. Paul Sr. should stay in his office and let the kids talent flow, instead he comes into the shop and creates a commotion that alienates him with all employees.
He is perfect example of a small time operator making it big, and forgetting the people who helped him get there. He can’t seem to get enough of himself. On the other hand Paul Jr. is reasonably low key and smart, who takes his successes in stride, getting his high from his accomplishments.
I am seventy five years old, seen a lot, started in the shop as an apprentice engineer. Went to night school at General Motors Institute of Technology, Wayne University, and Dale Carnegie Institute. In nine years I became Chief Engineer, went in business for myself, and was incorporated a total of five times.
Experience is hard to beat.
Gerald C Theriault
I agree wholeleheartedly! The basic rule of family relations, in my opinion, comes from the Bible and it in essence says Honor Your Father and Mother….Paul Jr. would do well to take heed. A business you can replace, family, in particular a father can’t be replaced.
I feel really sad for Paul Sr.. Most fathers would take great pride in a son as talented as Jr., but he is just too much of a jealous immature jerk to give Paulie or Mikey any credit for anything. Naturally they react negatively like his other son did. One of these days he will drop over dead and all the money and fame will count for nothing in the grand scheme of things. If I was getting a custom bike I would far prefer Paulie and Vinnie to design and build it over OCC. Without Paulie’s early signature bikes Paul Sr. would still be bending pipe for a living.
Paul Jr. would not be any one if not for his dad and the TV show. Paul Jr. could of done nothing on his own with out his dad. The banks would not lend Paul Jr. the money to start up a Kool Aid stand if he didn’t get his dad to co-sign the loan. There fore Paul Sr. is OCC not Paul Jr. This show has highlighted lots of unknown bike designers out there that until American Choppers no one had heard of. Does any one think that there are not still a few more out there that have Paul Jr’s ability that have not been dicovered yet? Paul Sr. is a business man and knows what his business will need to keep running. If he has to he will find the right person with the talent to take Paul Jr’s place designing bikes. Designers are a dime a dozen.
These guys have had a good run, In my view they met a great opportunity together and shared some awesome success. They even traveled the globe together and looked like a family.
It is time for an ending. It is time for an ending because greed had taken the front seat, power has become more important than freedom. As I have watched these grown men act like little kids, I can only say that it was VERY fun to watch, when it was fun to watch.
To see a father not in attendance to his son’s wedding, for whatever reason, appears to only send one clear message. This ain’t no game, someone is serious, and with that, It is clear.
Jr. Comes out saying he still loves his dad,even if his dad does not view his wedding as one of the most cherished days of his life.
Even if they shake hands,hug, and swear to forget it, This will not pass.
Money is now King.
Greed will Keep JR. going until he has SR’s car collection parked in his garage, SR will lie to congress (if needed) to prove a 20 million dollar building with employees, a brand, Tools, and product “is/are worthless”.
It was over when money became King.
I will be surprised if this bunch can convince the TV producers they “can” fill an hour for another complete season… I don’t see this as fun anymore, In fact I fear for someone could get hurt or locked up, before they convince themselves that they are really done.
I think this article must have been written by paul Sr himself. It’s pretty pathetic. I hope Jr makes Sr pay pay pay.
No it was written by me Melanie. How is it pathetic? Maybe you had a problem with your own father?
Norm
I am a long time member of this blog. I can honestly and frankly say that there has never been a pathetic article on this blog.
Even if I thought an article was pathetic….I would not say so. It takes a brave and confident person to pen anything.
We also live in a world where nobody seems to want to say good job to anyone.
I have always enjoyed this blog and learned many new things.
Thanks for your support Sandie!
Norm
Paul Sr. obviously has some anger management issues. No one tunes into the show to see Paul Sr. or what his next tantrum is going to be about. Paul Sr. obviously has an over inflated ego and lousy parenting skills. I hope Paul Jr. wins.
I guess I should say something about Paul Sr & Jr. When I first heard about their quarrel I thought it was a publicity stunt and didn’t really pay attention to it. Seeing that there is actually legal action being taken, I think it’s a shame. I hope they reconcile for real, despite cameras and crap. Good luck guys.
–Small Town Country Boy, no real formal education.
Ihave watched this show for ages & waited for this to happen,I have two sons the youngest is like Mikey & the eldest took over my business and has made something of it but one thing we have is respect for each other & for each others opinions.The most hurtful part of that programme is the fact that its fly on the wall tele & one minute they are at each others throat & then playing with each other & appearing as guests on TV talk shows all smiles,is this all contrived? not only is it on Quest but its back on discovery so I suggest they sit and watch alln the early shows that made them popular with family audiences,they seemed to more of a family then.What messages are they sending out to their young fans & special needs children that they so generously supported,Snr think of the torment you must be causing your mother!
I THINK PAUL jr. IS AN ASSHOLE HE THE ONE WITH THE BIG HEAD HE IS LAZY AND UGLY WHEN YOU SEE HIM ON TV TAKE A GOOD LOOK HE HAS A NOSE LIKE A PIG PAUL jr YOU ARE JUST A PEICE OF SHIT
i think a lot of you people out there have lost the plot the best COMMENT is the start of this blog work it out fellas what came first chicken or the egg ?
I love the USA!! We can turn channel if we don’t want to watch something or turn it off. Why would anyone watch a show they do not care for??
Paul Sr. and Jr. will make a fortune whatever is going on. They have both become very smart businessmen. They know to make the cash while the getting is good.
The article was great, but Paul Sr. has had a falling out with his oldest son Danny and now has had a falling out with his other 2 sons. That tells me one thing, that the problem lies with Paul Sr. If he has a problem with one son that is one thing, but when he has a problem all three of his boys, the problem lies with SR.
Isn’t it a shame that a father will sabotage his son’s success. I’m not defending Jr, he has his own issues, but I seriously dislike Sr as a father/person. How can a father even think of hurting his own blood? Sr admits to missing out on his kids childhood due to drugs and alcohol. And he’s pissed at the way they turned out? Does sr feel he gad nothing to do with that? Wether Sr believes it or not, his sons helped him build OCC. They should all get over themselves.
I actually quit watching the show about halfway through season 4 because I got sick of watching the way SR and JR were constantly disrespecting each other. I don’t know how much of the constant bickering was just made for TV but it got to be way too much.SR built a very successful business before the TV show. I’m sure he will continue to do well. I agree with many of the other people who have commented that they should both swallow their pride and apologize to each other. Life is way too short for this type of family squabble. I lost my father over 20 years ago and miss him dearly. We did a little work together and had a lot of fun. I don’t know whether we could have worked together but I was always very proud of what he was capable of and I know he was proud of my achievements. Watching the new show the one thing I do enjoy is the lack of screaming and yelling. It is interesting to watch the skill and art that these people put into a motorcycle. I think we needed more of that on the old show and a lot less of the family feuding. I think TV and the money and fame that came with it split up this family.
I have four sons so I have some idea about the subject. Paul Sr., in my opinion, is lacking as a father by the way he has treated those boys. No question Jr started slacking a bit in the end but how could anyone take the verbal abuse the old man gave Jr for so long. Paul Sr is full of himself. He even tries to undermine his son’s new business. What kind man would try and hurt his own child? Would it not be better to say, we don’t get along in business son so you go your way and I mine and I wish you all the luck in the world. Rather, Paul Sr tries to hurt his sons new business, continues to be verbal abusive in a public forum about him. No, Sr built a business and has done well with help of Jr along however, there is no justification to trash one of your children as he does. Very poor example of a good father. Paul Sr is a perfect example of narcissism.
I dare say that there isn’t an episode that I have not seen. I know that editing changes a lot of the story. Although, you make very valid points, I would put the lions’ share of the blame on Sr. If it was just Jr., being a spoiled bosses kid, the relationship between Sr., and his other children would be better. The whole family has major problems that, in my opinion, spring from Sr., being completely unreasonable to deal with. We are all different. I believe that Jr., feels like all his life Sr., has been trying to make him like Sr.
If Jr. was ever left to design and complete projects without all the yelling, his designs would be even better. I shutdown when someone is yelling at me. It clogs the mind and stifles creativity. I wouldn’t agree that designers are a dime a dozen. To see as an artist is true talent.
I have a great deal of respect for Sr. He has built an empire. It must be tearing him apart inside as a father. He needs to be more reasonable. He never concedes any argument. By the comments he makes about Jr., just make him look bad and immature. I believe that Jr. would be willing to salvage the relationship if Sr., would let love for his family lead him more than dollars. He doesn’t give Jr. any credit for the success he enjoys. It was a family/team effort.
Def agree with you that SR. goes off for no freaking reason. I loathe jerkoffs like that, but what I can’t believe is that Senior didnt even go to his son’s wedding. Now that is fucked up. For him just for one day letting all the crap go, and YOU go your damn Son’s wedding. So he became a major putz IMO (SR) . Enjoy your run on reality TV i enjoyed watchin you guys build amazing art, but after Putz face didnt bother to go to his sin’s funeral….I have to switch the channel forever…and I will not be watching another episode ever again. Senior, you lost a loyal viewer not that you give a shit because you don’t .
I would agree. Sr can be an ass. Not going to the wedding was nothing more than a complete lack of class and maturity. And his statement that going to Jr’s Geico unvail would take the attention off Jr. just proves that he is an extreme narcissist.
I totaly acree with evry coment to date. Paul sr is a total idiot to think he is the master mind of the co. His only input in the building of bikes was to hinder the whole process.He’s all mouth and butthole.Insperation and good craftmenship takes time and thought,it can’t rushed. Paul sr was the water in a well oiled machine. The crew paul jr has now are loyal and they will suceed.Paul sr is totaly out of contrll more so than before, if thats possible,. I no longer think of him as a jerk but a coniving evil man doing as much as possible to demorize and hinder any chace for Paul jr’s sucess. I pray for Paul jr’ Mickey and his loyal crew the honors. of which they truly deserve.
paul sr is the father and should make mends with his sons.im a father of 3 and would never let money or our company get between me and my sons.money comes and goes but family doesnt.
I believe the truth behind all this fued comes down to the new wife. Just think if she gets the kids out of the business she gets it all. He is the sucker at the end. Once he is gone she will remarry and his sons who worked didn’t work the business are left dry. Although they lived it from the beginning when they were nobodies. He ought to be ashamed to be so old and not wise. He thinks all who surround him are true friends and care about him. If there is one thing I see in the show is people who only tollerate SR. A bunch of brown noses. When there is money you can be an ass and people would laugh. At the end when all is said and done, if he were ever left out dry the only ones who would be there for him would be his sons and he is so proud he can’t see straight. Just let something to god forbid happen to one of his sons, Let’s see what that would make him feel like. Regret, on all those should of, could of, would of’s when it is too late, it is just too late. If the wife would be worth anything and truly not after this empire she would play a heftier role in mending the bond in this family. Not give in and let it be. A good woman makes the man. Lack there of he is just with a trophy wife and she is just a gold digger.
It breaks my heart to think that these two people (I don’t really count Mikey ‘cos he’d go with the majority whatever happened)are at one an-others’ throats to this extent.
I have become a complete fanatic , watching the goings on on a daily basis and admire the work that Paul jnr. does!
I too worked in a father and son set up and let me tell you nothing you ever do as a son is ever good enough!! The father in the partnership always seems to admire what his son does but can NEVER admit to it!!
It appears to me that Paul snr. could never do what his son does if he tried till eternity but he would never admit so ‘cos it was him who taught him everything he knows (even if he didn’t and in this case it’s obvious that it isn’t true!!)Yet in a way he is jealous of what he can do , although he’d never admit that either!
The sad thing is that as was shown in one of the programs which aired recently, they love each other so very much and if Paul snr. wasn’t so pig headed he would admit that not only is there love but also admiration to the greatest degree!!
Court case – NO they don’t need a judge to rule over them just get Paul seniors mother and let her knock their heads together because given the chance I wouldn’t mind betting she could stop this fighting between father and son and get them to shake and make up and get back to how it should have stayed. Not fighting like alley cats
And then go and make more of what they do best and entertain housebound invalids like me who adore everything about them except their inn fighting!!!
Accept what you’ve got and relish it don’t throw it away and give all your money to solicitors who have got enough of their own and don’t need yours.
I see conflicting but reasonable perspectives above, but one needs to look deeper.
Watching the show, you can see that Paul Sr. is an ego centric, childlike and very sensitive person, and the boys are realatively well adjusted, but still effected by the roots of drug and alcohol addiction.
Senior has techniques and behaviors that are intended to keep others off kilter and under control. Not terrible, unless you are sensitive to them. Notice that some of the guys are totally uneffected. Instead, Junior has a system to battle with him largely through passive resitance.
Look, Seniors “hardnosed” posing with vendors is typical of small business guys that survive, but shouldn’t be considered advanced business skills. But, he is to be admired for what he built through talent, tenacity and probably a lot of hard work. In that regard, other team members should treat him as the unequivical boss, no doubt.
Paul Jr. is an artistic first, and very talented mechanic that is really a bit more talented than Senior, due to his accelerated learning from Senior at a young age. He also has a real strength that the others lack and that is vision and perfectionism in design. This isn’t always good for business, but it is a trait he shares with Senior.
In a real management situation, all that is required is coaching of Junior, and more recognition of his skills, rather than the boss always trying to “one up” him. This is what creates the back and forth contention between father and son, or any senior exec with a junior talented exec.
This is the scenario that keeps most small businesses from surviving a management transition, and usually results in selling off the business or assets when the founder hits a certain age. Founders just rarely know how to train and transition themselves up and out. It takes more patience and humility than they can muster.
I thought I would look up Seniors age, which is 61. Realize that if the show were to last, there is a point very shortly where Senior cannot be the star. Watcing this morning, that is realistically less than two years, unless Senior starts taking care of himself better, in which case it could be extended a few more years.
The real star of the show is THE FAMILY first, and the bikes second. The helpers, investors, managers and fabricators that were brought in on the show, are just that. They are helpers with no real “prescence” for TV. Accordingly, it is Junior’s presence on the show, as flat as it is, that provides a long term platform for Senior to remain on the show for as long as they can stand each other-or agree to fight on TV for money. The more drama and nonsense the better. This eventually leads to Senior rolling in on a wheelchair to scream and yell and say “I can do it better still!” Look, they all have essentially flat personalities, and all look slightly traumatized by drug use, either past or current.
You know, it just occurred to me. The reason why they fight so much, is probably because Senior is off the drugs and Paul Junior looks like a chronic pot head. He has all the traits of a Pot Addict (I know many don’t believe there is such a thing, but there is). This can really get under a recovered addict’s (Senior) skin. If that is the case, it is not sustainable.
If it goes on much longer with Senior, a Dog and some “helpers”, it will be over soon (for TV). When I watch it, despite the excellent bike work, it is really a story of an overbearing recovering addict in a struggle with himself-will he alienate his kids and fail alone, find the strength to change himself, again (the first being drugs), now the addiction is EGO!
Should Junior learn the hard lessons about being a businessman the hard way, to learn and understand about the difficulties of managing tardy and undisciplined staff? Sure. But these guys are on TV now. Junior has enough exposure and talent to have 100 talented businessmen helping him go to the next level. But if they had the clarity to understand the risks of a) starting someting new; b) going on with the show without the “Team” versus the guarantee of milking the existing format with the full team-it would be a no brainer. That is the entertainment business.
If you look at Senior closely, he feels very bad without the interchange with Junior. Frankly, it is probably all a made up conflict. If so, then we would learn who the real creative entertainment type is. Whoever invented the conflict for TV.
Note: I was in the entertainment business for quite some time, and ran a TV shopping network for a while. When we an average salesman (cars, shoes, basic stuff) and put him/her on TV, they would become a “STAR”, with all the problems that implies (some became like Elizabeth Taylor for gudes sake). When you put a business on TV, you are in the STAR MANAGEMENT business, amoung other things.
Interesting how people can watch something and arrive at completely different conclusions. Yes, I think Jr head did get a bit big, but watching the “I Robot” bike being built, Sr does nothing but give grief. Contributes nothing to the idea, or the construction of the bike, yet it is Sr who PROUDLY rides the bike in to the premier. I think this is typical of the relationship, Sr is really riding on the coat tales of Jr. He an artistic Zero, his ability to build is limited. He should retire, except he likes to bully people around to much to give up being boss of something. I think Jr will go on to more success.
Further, IMO, I think Jr will win on appeal as the agreement seems only an agreement to agree, nothing more. And I believe Sr. attempt to value Jr shares at $0 shows his real character, childish, vindictive.
I would say that Paul Sr is his own worst enemy. He acts like a total imbecile. I honestly think its due from a combination of long term drug use and too much testosterone (he’s probably getting testosterone injections even though he’s natural levels are within normal range). Just look at the way he flips out and how incoherent he gets talking completely out of his ass when he gets upset every 20 seconds.
Publicity stunt.
It’s pretty sad what has happened here. Paul Jr. may be acting like a kid sometimes, he obviously brought a lot to the table and helped make that business famous. A father shouldn’t sue his son. Period. Paul senior appears to be a total asshole and seems to have whole host of other problems, including acting more like a child than anyone. He’s a selfish jerk.
I carry my fathers name. My dad has been gone for eight yrs now and the grief I feel is beyond description. My dad was a master mechanic, he taught master mechanics for 13 yrs. Was well known and respected by people all over our area here in Harlan,Ky. He started working as a young boy in my Grand dads garage in Cawood Ky. My dad made 99% of the money for the garage. Being the only son and considering his talent and contributions my dad assumed someday he would inherit the busines. He felt he’d earned it. One evening in the garage, a friend of my fathers made the comment that he guessed Sonny,(my dads nick name); would take over the business someday. My grand father sat for a second and then said,” Sonny will never have the money to buy this place.” That evening my dad loaded up his tools and we moved from Cawood, Ky to Naugatuck Conn. My dad became a machine Journeyman at Pratt & Whitney Aircraft. Offered a position on Airforce One’s maintainance crew. When my grand father died my dad never shed a tear at his funeral. Greed had destroyed father and son. My dad never recovered from the hurt his dad’s betrayal placed in his heart. Im not a mechanic like my dad. I do some things I learned growing up in the garage, neither are my two brothers mechanics. My mom didn’t want us in the garage where it was dangerious. I did inherit a love for ridding motorcycles from my father, thus my interest in Orange County Choppers, father and sons. The antics are entertaining, the bikes are works of art. So very, very sad that father and sons let things come to this. All that money and success at a cost of family break down. I will pray for all of them to make amends before it is to late to do so.
you are totally right. I quit watching OCC because Paul Sr. Seems to be jellious of Jr and it is a big soap opera. Jr was the brains in the design and don’t get any credit. I wish we all could see what went on when the cameras were off. I think mikey is very fragile right know and if this don’t soon resolve something bad is going to happenand if it does thank yourself Paul Sr.
i too had a master mechanic / racingcar builder father,,,,the bikes this company builds are art pieces nothing more,,yes they are ridable but registerable? i think not,,they dont even come close to dot spec,,no destruction tests on the wheels they cnc,,no directionals,,, absolutely horrible riding positions,,ect,,,the list would be very long indeed, and as a former dirt track rider i feel and know they are very dangerous machines,,,,,they are pure fantasy,,,more of a rolling sculpture than anything else,,even JJ from from the other chopper show from not too long ago had major problems just trying to ride from LA to sturgis,,i would take one as a gift to sell,,,i wouldn’t put one mile on either of the firms machines,,i can however apprieciate the masterful metalwork and paint,,,absolutely incredible,,as far as the personalitys go,,,i think they both need a check up from the neck up,,,start building some real motorcycles that actually ride with realistic suspensions and ergononics and decent engines,,,and not the same ol saw of clone harley mills stuffed in an stretched frame,,i actually liked paul srs take on the flathead i saw a little while ago,,,,why people buy these machines is beyond me,,,mostly for the ad exposure ill wager a guess,,,
I agree with you on this deal.My father is the same way (demanding) but the intentions are for the best.Paul jr. should apologize to his father wich built the buisness his son is taking for granted and at the same time tareing his family apart.Hopefully jr want wait to his dad is gone to do the right thing.I’ve heard and know that you dont know what you had until you lose it for good.I’ll be praying for the teutal family and god bless yall.
I think we’re underestimating Paul senior. He’s a successful business and this incident could be nothing more than what it is – a show! Paul senior and junior could have planned all this all behind scenes. This lawsuit recaptured my attention as I am sure it did with other viewers. Business is expanding!
All TV money at it’s best, had to start a new twist for the show to keep going(needed it). Big money on TV, anyone beleive that it is actually true about the break-up? Discovery Channel is keeping it alive by splitting up the family(at least for the time being) the there will be a big get back together series that takes a year of viewing. Wake up viewers, it’s TV ENTERTAINMENT AND MONEY!!!!!!!!! Btw I do watch it for Entertainment only, that is the only reason that it is on like all other reality shows. People that beleive that this is ALL real, believe that wrestling is not fake either. Sorry to pop some bubbles here, but take a reality check please.
I don’t understand, have any of you watched the show or read anything about them? OCC was started by both Pauls just a few years ago(I think it was one year before the show). Sr. didn’t invest anymore in it than Jr. did. They were both working out of a garage, both were grown men, both are owners(equal I belive). This is something Jr. grew up watching his dad do or build up. This was both their idea, both their sweat and blood, both their loss of money and time.
Jr. doesn’t owe Sr. anymore than if I started a business with my dad today. We’d both be part owners. Now Sr. acting like he’s been doing this for 20 years or something. They both chopped their first bike 10 years ago, Jr. designed the logo at the begining, Sr. named the company. Jr. doesn’t owe Sr. dick. I always thought it was stupid that Jr. let Sr. yell at him for coming in late. If I was part owner in a business with anyone, they sure the hell wouldn’t tell me how to set my hours.
Now the Iron Works is different. Sr. did build that from the ground up. He worked hard at it. OCC is just a pipe dream that wouldn’t have gone past their first tiny garage if they hadn’t got the T.V. show.
Hello
First, my apologies for asking you how old are you.
If this is inappropriate question, as I said, my sincere apologies.
Therefore, please, delete/disregard this email.
However, your age will help me understand your thinking about this subject:
“Orange County Chopper Father and Son in Bitter Lawsuit”
Thank you, Sinisha
Your take on junior may be right, BUT IT’S TV, you are watching an edited, 1 hour a week episode of these guys lives and you think you know what happened. It could all be fake just to see who’s more popular or they just needed to spice the show up.
I’ve been watching the show now for several months, and have gotten hooked on it. It’s uncanny how many similarities there are to my own experience as an eldest son struggling to keep a sense of perspective while working in a family business dominated by a overbearing father.
I can see that Paul Sr has a deeper sense of the overall business operations than does Paul Jr. However, Paul Jr. is hands down the creative brains and master craftsman while Sr is, in most things, a total troglodyte when it comes to managing people, crafting a cool motorcycle design, or even just showing a little sensitivity towards his kids.
Sr’s ego is about the same size as his muscle-bound cave bear physique. He has to growl constantly like a steroidal drama queen because that the only way he can steal the thunder from his well-deserving eldest son. Sr even favors Mikey (who else but a complete slacker?) because he doesn’t feel threatened by Mikey’s so-called talents (class clown? perpetual kid? tells a good joke? amuses people by always fucking up?). Sr would do better to simply allow both his sons to shine in their own way and back off the stage a bit, maybe even go back to his cave to brood in silence.
My own father was also a good businessman, but arrogant to the extreme, moody, paranoid, self-centered, and constantly threatened by his sense of not getting enough love in his life nor willing to give me credit for my efforts. As the bright, conscientious, always wanting to please eldest son I constantly had to put out fires with pissed off critical vendors, offended customers, dispirited employees, in short, almost everyone my father came into contact with during his business day.
Without someone like Paul Jr around, OC Choppers wouldn’t be the success that it turned out to be. Without me, my mother, and my brother around our family’s business wouldn’t have been successful either. I cannot ever remember my father admitting that to his family, but it was so obviously true to everyone but him. Ultimately, just as I had to do, Paul Jr left his father’s business. It took a lot of guts. More power to him for standing up to a complete tyrant like his father.
I’ve seen them all up close and personal and paul Sr. is not as big as he looks. His ego is as large as any I’ve ever seen.
The bikes that they built were actually crap. I would have been afraid to ride one across the parking lot for fear it would break in half.
They are the biggest nio-talent groups I’ve ever seen and I quit watching because of the screaming and yelling and destroying of expensive vehicles on theor show. If you have that much money that you can just destroy your vehicles, then you have too damn much and sure won’t be getting any from me who works hard for my money!!!!
Hers my favorite part of the show…. I watch the Paul sr. parts, and every time he says “ya know” in a sentence, I drink a beer, last nights how, i drank 16 cases…. SENIOR IS A MORON, JUNIOR IS THE REAL TALENT….WATCH NEXT WEEK AS SENIOR LOSES HIS HOUSE AND BANK ACCOUNT TO THAT WHORE HE MARRIED THAT HE FOUND ON AN AIRPLANE…… ” YA KNOW?”
Paul snr you deserve more respect,so many many people against you at the moment because they are completely jealous of what you have, and achieved on your own,dont change for anybody,let them change,
you like being a winner,so stay that way,we all know what u get for running second,wish you all the best snr,you have my vote and i dont change my mind once i make my decision,,,,good luck
Every father wants more than the best for his son. Paul Snr is justified in expecting his son to pull his weight. the same if not more than anyone else, he is co-owner of a very profitable company. If he wants the easy life win the lottery….
I an at the moment watching OCC, Paul Jnr is re-designing a bar-b-cue, do you think he is happt doing that, come on.
I feel i can say these things as i am in the same position as paul Snr, maybe worse. My son has not spoken to me in fifteen years………and i do nor know why. All i can say is i miss him.
It would be interesting to see this show in 20 years time, Paul Jnr, now Paul Snr with a 20 year old son who bum’s around. Wonder what he would say.
Is your son an asset to society? No matter your frustration with your communication or disappointment with the way he does things, in the end it doesn’t mean anything. Call him tell him your sorry for everything you did. (even if your not, let it go) Tell him you miss him. Tell him you need him. Support him in his creative or motivated ventures. let him learn from his own mistakes. Most of all tell him you love him.
Don’t send an effigy of him off a ramp into a horrific wreck. (Just a thought)
I agree with Hawkeye. It’s never too late to repair a relationship as long as you’re both alive. Tell him you love him, tell him you miss him, tell him you don’t want to waste one more second of time over whatever it was that separated you two. When one of you is gone, it will be too late. Pick up the phone. Love your son.
Listen, I worked for OCC. (2007-2009) I can personaly tell you that Paul sr, is a fool. The bikes everyone has come to know from the show were mostly Paul jr’s designs. NOT Paul sr’s. I can also tell everyone that OCC would not be where it is today without Paul Jr’s desigins. Paul Jr will do well in the bike building field on his own.
While I may agree that Paul Jr play’s a key roll in the bike design an fabrication he did not do it on his own,there are others in this group of bike builders/designers that should be commended and rewarded as well.
What I see is that Paul Jr. grows up and money,power
and all the lavishment of this show is splitting a family apart.
I do not know all the particulars so my apologies
are being made for some mis-understandings on my part.
If it’s an act more power to them. If not I can’t belive they both can’t see they are better off together. If my father screamed your terminated in front of our shop that would be a hard to take. I would hope he would show me the respect to come to me with an explanation. Jr is a grown man he deserves to have some pride. How do you think Sr would act if someone said that to him? I guess thier lawyers must love them. If Sr claims there is no value in Jr shares,in the company, I’d be willing to pay for them.
I agree whit some what to what you say in theory. Being a business person for 47 years I know what makes and what breaks a family business.
I totally agree that JR is a asshole, a real asshole, in every way. lazy, dumb, jerky and I have the right to call him a asshole. A matter a fact every one in the world has the right to call him a asshole. (he is). And I hope he reads this to see what people really think of him . BUT Like I said I and everyone else has the right to call him that. EVERYONE has the right..BUT PAUL SR. . Big ass Paul Sr forgot one think.. He is your son ! Your the only person (outside his mother) that does not have the right to say the things he has about and to his son. “Your his father”. If there is one BIGGER asshole in the world it’s Paul SR. He should just go into the office , count his money ( that is what this is really about) and let the NEXT generation of his family take over. Stop ruling your kids life. You have enough money to live out your like very comfortably, let the next generation take over. Stay home play in the mounds of money the TV series made you and let your kids do THERE own thing.. It’s not to late, otherwise your going to be rich and alone. All alone.
if your kids going to fail, NO ONE CAN EVERY SAY YOU DID NOT GIVE HIM A CHANCE.
But then I could be wrong, my kids took my company and made me richer then I every dreamed I could be. I made 100K back in 1970, today they feed me ten times that. there are far from perfect, so say reckless but there MY kids, and they at lease know I am proud of them. Even dog get a warm spot of the sidewalk.. Your kids deserve better.
Well said. There are lines that parents (and children) should never cross.
OCC , Sr. and Jr. are just cake decorators. With rare exceptions its ‘cut the fenders and tank a bit different, weld on some crap from the clients business, then “power coat, paint and chrome”’
Why do they have to say that every time? “Powder Coat, Chrome and Paint” I’ll bet half the people watching haven’t a clue what power coat is… And everyone knows what chrome is. Leave it go at “paint “.
And while I’am at it… If I hear “I Gota Tell Ya etc etc or To Be Honest…” Iam gona execute my TV. For that reason I stopped watching.
Or ‘To be honest” Does that mean the rest of the time your not honest?
Or “Take it to the next level” How many levels are there? (can there be) ?
Or “This is the best bike we ever did” There can only be one “BEST”
The people they have do the paint are the real talent.
Hell … I’d rather watch a show of Mike’y painting (what he calls it) than the “DRAMA” of Sr. and Jr.
You ever notice how every bike they build is under a time crunch and yet they have time to beat the hell out of a car or truck or go fishing or do some other time wasting thing? DRAMA….. !!!
I started watching the show to see some creativity in bike building. Now I hope the DISCOVERY channel gives OCC the big boot and adds more “Biker Build Off’s” Now THERE IS TALENT !!!
MY ADVICE:
1) Mike’y … Get a real job. Can you say ‘Would you like to Super Size that order’… Your not funny. You can’t paint. The one bike you built was a POS…. Your hanging onto the shows skirt tails and that won’t last forever.
2) Jr. You went in way over your head with that new shop. You didn’t need one that large to start with. Good Luck with it. I hope you have a VERY DEEP pocket. And PLEASE stop with the “I gota tell ya and To be honest and Next level. Send me an email when you start building again and I’ll think about watching the show.
3) Sr. GET RID OF THE SUN GLASSES INDOORS !!! As tough as you think you are or want to be, sunglasses indoors makes you look like a fool. (which you are). You may have built a few bikes in your basement a long time ago but you are now at the next level of the next lever of the last level of the next level. You might consider flipping burgers with Mike’y. Iam sure Discovery paid you quite well. Take the money and run.
4) Vinney… Start your own show building bikes not DRAMA.
5) Rick… Go in with Vinney…
6) The Rest of you at OCC… Start looking for a new job…
I realize that Sr. and Jr. have some unresolved issues from the past but, in order to move on, they both need to take some responsibility for their actions. Mikey wants the three of them to see a therapist and i agree. However, Sr.says he’s been there and done that and does not want to be subjected to the criticism of how he was a bad father and was never there for them. I watch this show religously and have come to adore each and every one of them. I don’t know how dependable Jr. is when the cameras are off but when they’re on it seems to me he’s pretty dedicated to the builds he is asked to do and he and everyone involved in the builds do a phenomenal job and i think Sr. is pretty tough on him and lacks faith in his ability to get the job done. But, i also think Jr. lacks respect for his father. He needs to realize that alot of what he knows about building bikes he learned from his father and Sr. needs to know that mikeys request for therapy isn’t about wanting to tear him down or rip him apart, it’s about finding out what’s really going on inside of themselves. You guys have already lost a lot of years with each other that you’ll never back don’t lose anymore.
Anyone who suggests seeing a shrink needs his sissy-ass kicked hard.Mikey’s truly mentally ill. He’s not funny to me anymore.I’ve lost all respect for him,but I’ll like him again.
Everyone likes tormenting Sr.because he’s King of the Hill,just like any boss.But he is right.No Shrink.Sit down alone and straighten this nonsense out.It’ll take a whole 2 minutes. And Mikey should stop his sneakily throwing fire on the pilot light.
I laugh at this article. I believe this is a publicity stunt dreamed up by the Discovery Channel and Orange County Choppers. This is obviously a fictitious fallout
between Paul Sr. and Paul Jr. This is a way for advertisement and publicity for the show through new media such as the news, the newspapers, and any other media that may pick up this story. Also do not forget the increased ratings which puts money in everybody’s pocket. This sort of thing happens all the time in so called “Reality Television” Which is almost as scripted as a sitcom or a crime drama. This is a marketing ploy that will eventually work itself out and everyone will be better off financially.
I dont have time nor have I read all the shit on these blogs. I hope you two men can get past the bullshit because life just really is just too short, I will not agree or dsagree with neither one of you because to I like show you BOTH created. But both of you need to realize the thing called life will happen fast and you have no control over it. Peace to all and I love the show
I am on Paul sr’s side I think he just spiled his children too much was the worst thing he done pauly needs to and is learning that running a business is not as easy as it lokks and he needs to realize if it was not for his dad he wouldnt have what he has or even know how to build a bike I think it is very sad to see this family is forever i think paul srs health is something that pauly needs to take into consideration this could break his fathers heart and cause him to have a heart attack i just hope pauly dont have to live with any guilty feelings my best to the original occ Paul Sr is a loving father.
IF I were ever to work for an ass hole like sr. i would say i can’t tell you how to run your compamy. but i can tell you where to run it, run it up your a** . and walk out.
Paul SR is not a loving father. Loving parents don’t badger, belittle, degrade, and bully their family members in the public’s eye. When SR goes, they can stick him with a pin and bury him in a shoe box.
Please, it is all fake. Its television, the Senior, Junior feud is just a storyline dreamed up by the show’s producers. All reality TV is scripted. You will see that by the last episode they will be ready to get back together, but you will have to tune in next season to see it.
Paul Jr, is a spoiled brat raised buy an ego maniac. I bet they are less happy inside now than before
the show.
They got hit by the fame monster hard!
I think Paul Jr needs to honor his father and allow his father to buy him out from Orange County Choppers.
Paul Jr need to know the 5th commandmend: honor your father and mother. Paul Jr needs to let go and honor his father. Everything will work out in the end. It’s interesting to note the Carolina Carports Inc spokeswoman referred to the love and respect for her father, and also thanked Senior for having Junior, who would eventually create that cool red chopper for Carolina Carports, and get the key to the city on top of it.
i think the whole damm show is fake and mikey is just as stupid as he looks
love your show,you have my wife cussing,and it gets her off my
back.if you want more viewers,someone break in to each others
shop,or shot holes in each others building,then you can get some
real viewers,just a thought.
WHEN JR. HAS HIS FIRST CHILD AND THAT CHILD IS OLD ENOUGHT TO DISAGREE
HE WILL LOOK BACK AND RETHINK!!!
i hear about mike and paul jr.but no one says anything about the oldest boy danny be fired too , why did he get let go .
Tell me baout Danny
Most of you are not attuned enough to know what is going on behind the scenes. There most likely is a dark reason why Jr is late and causing his work to slip. What you are not seeing is his lack of focus from “partying” too much and this has greatly upset Sr cause he knows where this ends. While Sr does deserves a lot of credit getting where he is, he also has an anger management problem while managing by hostility is not an MBA approved method, it works sometimes given the personalities you have to ride herd on. If the real truth were to come to light, it would negatively impact their business and harm OCC beyond belief. Given they are all role models, they can ill afford to tarnish their good guy image. Unless this is all just a Hollywood plot in which case we are all being taken for a ride. Looks like the show got picked back up on Discovery and Vinnie is the real brains of the operation anyway. Should stay interesting.
I am 50 years old and have ridden bikes since my first mini bike when I was 8. my latest bike is 2003 Hyabusa. I put over $4,000.00 in the motor and other suspention parts. I have spent so many years in awe of your bikes. I am not a bike machanic although i am extremely good at metal fab and am very mechanical but never good enough for your incredible staff you are truely they most talented people I have ever seen. I am a personal trainer and have been for 27 years, my degree is in Kenesiology. I would literally do anything for your company for as long as possible to earn a bike such as your professionals can make. I know this sound rediculous but unlike my income once was do to what has happened to our country my services are no longer worth what they once were. I would do anything for your company for as long as possible to make it possible to even get the lowest level of your bikes. I was a competitive bodyguilder for 17 years and won the cal. npc super heavy weights in 1997 so i do admire paul sr. for his for his continued work toward keeping his size and the old school alive. I admire all of you for your touphness and tenacity, thanks kevin sturgeon i hope to hear back.
paul sr.has been in recovery for a few years now and he has to realize that there are reasons for his past life style. he has some serious anger issues and until he addresses these issues in a medical and spiritual way his problems will continue. it will always be second verse same as the first.
I have watched this show since inception,and if Paul SR thinks that Paul JR cant build a bike without his expertise,well I got news for him , he can build a bike better and with a smaller crew, a better crew, not to knock Rick, who is a good metal man. Paul SR is disslusional
shame on you paul sr. are you going to feel guilty if something happens to one of your boys/ you think that you have a lot of time to make amends but things happen that you can not take back. my son passed away 2 months ago and i wish that i could go back and do things different. life is so precious and goes by so fast so swallow your stupid pride and start making amends. i do not have a chance to do it with my son but you do so be a man and go to your sons and hug them and love them . my heart breaks for my son and there is nothing that i can do, but you can . i hope that you do the right thing and make up with your sons.man up.
I have to agree with what you say – Sr should realize that tomorrow is promised to no one and he should fix this now while he can. If this is all about money – there is no amount of money worth the loss of your children. The thing that really I find most hurtful is the way Sr is always
putting Jr down. He discredits him at every opportunity – what father does that?! He knows that Jr will see those comments which makes it even worse than even saying it to his face. Can’t he just be proud of his son – his new business and how well he is doing and give him credit for what he did in the past. All Sr is doing is demeaning himself by his own actions. I use to have some respect for Sr; but, now I don’t. I am Sr’s age and would love to say he is right but I just can’t. I hope Mikey and Pauley continue to hang in there and support each other. My prayers are with this family and that they will find their way back to each other and let the pride go.
The thing is SR is a very poor father and I’d never buy a bike from OCC. I feel bad for all the people involved but at the same time they act so stupid that I can’t believe they are still on the air and peddling the crap they make. GO GET A REAL JOB SR…. ALL YOU DO IS RUN YOUR MOUTH AND SIT ON YOUR BUTT. You act niggeredly!
I feel sorry for Mikey who tries to keep it all together. He looks hurt and physically upset over all the fights over the years.
I thin Sr. should consider going to a therapist for a lenght of time. He is one who thinks he has no problem. He is probably the reason Jr. is the way he is. All of the yelling and the putdowns can build a wall that after awhile cannot be climbed.
I am praying for all of you and your families. Jan
i could understand how they both feel. what i do not understand why they did not go for proffesional help. it is not like fixing a broken bike. it is a life long effort on all to want to mellow things out. i sence they truly love one another but ignorant in human behavior. i am no professional but lived thru that kind of abuse all my life. life is to short, like everyone says. nothing is more important then your family!
No doubt Paul Sr. is a loudmouth a-hole. Paul jr., however, is a loudmouth punk, who couldn’t design his was out of a paper bag if he had directions. His bikes were wretched mish-mashes of crap. He’d be cleaning restrooms at McDonald’s if it weren’t for his dad, so he should kiss Paul Sr’s arse, apologize, then go apply at Mickey D’s. I hear they’re hiring.
A quote from Jr from an older show. “Hey Rick, how big of a circle can you make with your Protractor?” What a dumb ass. A Protractor measures angles, a compass draws circles. This is from a designer? He obviously didn’t pay much attention in school. That is if he even went to school. Sr was correct by getting rid of the lazy ass kids.
I HAVE BEEN WATCHING THE SHOW FOR ABOUT A SHORT TIME UNTILL I SEE WHAT IT IS AND I CHANGE THE CHANNEL. THE SHOE HAS TURN INTO A SHOW THAT IS RANK RIGHT UP WITH JERRY SPINGER. MIKE SAID WHAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN HE DOES NOT WANT TO CHANGE HIS FATHER HE JUST WANTS HIS FATHER TO PUT A CAP ON HIS ANGER. IF YOU THINK LIFE IS SHORT ON NOT SAYING WHAT NEEDS TO SAY LIKE I SORRY FOR BEENING A BAD FATHER OR BAD SON TRY IT WHEN YOU DIE.
Paul Sr. and OC Choppers has taken a ride on the shoulders of the advertising opportunities produced at the hands of JR’s creativity and the resultant discovery channel exposure. SR complains about JR’s tardiness but as I see it, SR may get to the shop earlier the days HE shows up, but then is nonproductive or counterproductive for the duration of the day. You’re on the right track JR and your head is on square. I love your efforts to treat your employees with respect and opportunity. I predict that your personal creativity in your new business will overshadow OC Choppers emblem on a mass produced cycle.
SR: See a shrink and the best of luck with that.
JR: Here’s wishing you, your employees, and your company the very best for your future.
You CAN always hire someone with a good business sense, they are being shot out of schools daily. You CANNOT alway hire someone to create the bikes Jr. made. No one was buying the bikes Sr. was making! Jr. put him on the map. Time will tell but the creativity is at Paul Jr. Design, that is what people want!
You kidding me? 95% of all business fail. You can be the best at any craft and fail because of how the business is ran. Education teaches you how to work for someone. I agree with the article. Jr will run out of capital. I think for sure if the show ends and there is no more free publicity. OCC is branded and is self sustainable now without the show.
now after 1 year later occ is going down and pjd is keep growing and expanding meanwhile occ can’t pay their debt ond try to move to the old building. i saw the 911’s bike memorial and pjd’s 911 bike memorial. pjd is by far building the best bike. creativity is not something u can learn in any school. will u admit that u were wrong, i hardly doubt it.
What do you mean OCC is going down. They got a loan modification on their mortgage. In order to do that they had to not pay for a few months. All in all I like OCC’s bikes better than PJD’s bikes. To be frank I would not ride any of their bikes. What, did you have a problem with your father growing up?
Norm
No doubt the Dad is like mine. VERY VERY oldschool. He loves his son as my Dad did. My Dad made Paul Sr. Look like an angel. I understand now why my Dad was the way he was. You have to be strong to own a business. What did the Dad say? Ill give you stock but I want to see more from you. The son in turn continually came in late and had extended lunches. This has been going on for ever. Could anyone belate all the time and still have a job. When the Dad had it and screamed at the kid pointing out his son’s casual antics. The son said “I made this company.” then he picks up a chair in his boss/Dad’s office and throws it. Why? Because the Dad said stop coming in late and goofing off. Then the Dad says I want to buy back my stock. The son says no so Sr sues him AFTER the son is uncooperative. The son is a spoiled brat. Mikey is just an idiot. I mean what does he do? The Dad goes to the therapist and he bitches. The Dad says lets talk about anything and Mikey does not. Then Mikey doesnt even show up and a coffe shop when he said he ould. Tell me whos being an idiot?
You forgot a couple of things,
1. Yes Jr was coming in late, but the bikes got done on time. I’ve worked in pressure areas like that, TV production for one. When you stay up late working on a project, coming in late is not only normal, in union film, it’s the rule. Your thinking of it as a 9-5 job, and it isn’t. At a 9-5 pace they’d miss a lot of deadlines.
2. Dad’s offer to by Jr’s stock had the value at 000.00 Now, do you really believe Jr’s what 25% of OCC is worth ZERO?? That’s why he wouldn’t “sell,” actually give his 25% of the Co he helped to build to his father for ZERO. Sr should have made him a good faith offer if he really wanted to buy Jr’s 25%.
3. Yes Jr blew up, but after being bullied by Sr most of his life. Sr seldom ever turned a wrench, yet was always on Jr to do something quickly, however he had lost touch with how long building parts takes.
4. Mikey is a lot smarter than given credit for. Can you make a living with out doing anything??? 🙂 Mikey does.
Don’t talk about someone until you have walked in their shoes. Maybe Jr is/was not the perfect son, but from watching this show, he had very little in the way of a father to look up too. A drunk, abusive, both verbally and physical, does not make a good roll model and definitely does not make one have to cowtow to that person after they have helped you with a job, etc. The part me and my sons do not understand about this whole mess is why does Sr keep on talking “trash” about Jr. Why can’t that dirty ole man just shut the hell up and take care of OCC’s business and quit slamming his son. It is not like Jr is his only son, but, he is the only son Sr talks “shit” about. He will never get Mikey back on his side as long as he is against Jr, and also, where is Dan? When did that relationship fall apart? Wake up everyone! You have 3 sons, 3 bad relationships! Not the sons faults. Guess what, it must be dear old daddy’s.
He’s the only son that talks and walks thinking he’s the shit he’ll find out the hard way how dare he treat his dad like that if it wasn’t for him he would be a average joe. it’s not all senior
He is the only sn that does ANYTHING and when you are the one to do it all, it kind of sucks to hear you are doing it wrong, from someone who really does NOTHING!!!!!! Jr. should not have been disrespectful, but a person could only take soo much. WTF The bitter old man needs to shut his trap, he may have had the funds to back OCC, but he did not by any means have the talent. This is where he needs to go in the office or play golf because I have not watched one episode where Paul SR contributed anything but negativity to the work place… sucks when you are perfect and none compares!~ I am quite sure Paul SR was out banging everything that moved…very convenient to forget what it is like to be young:(
And who is that low life trying to get into the middle of Sr and Jr??
I think the OCC foreclosure thing is a scam thought up by Sr’s lawyer to be able to show in court that Jr’s 20% isn’t worth anything…
Paul Sr. is an arogant egotistical pain in the butt. He’s a control freak. I think this falling out bothers him more than Jr. He takes every opportunity to put his son down. He must know Jr. is going to hear his comments. Its unfortunate that this is playing out on television. Great for ratings. Jr. does not owe Sr. an apology. Perhaps Sr. should encourage his son and wish him well with his new business. If it was just Jr. having problems with Sr. I might say Sr. is not all to blame. It is all Sr. NONE OF HIS SONS TALK TO HIM. He’s the father the patriach of the family. He should figure out a way to bring the family together instead of suing his son for stock options. So immature.
Paul Sr. = White trash with money.
Sr was ALWAYS on Jr’s case about not coming to work exactly on time, etc. In fact, even after Jr left and started up his own company, Sr ALWAYS finds way to talk bad about Jr and also does sophmorish stunts just to try to piss off Jr. He’s just a bitter old man who’s sons don’t want anything at all to do with him anymore. Success got to his head, made him filthy rich and somewhat “in”famous. How many times do you see him design and build a motorcycle? He usually sits in his office and bitches about Jr. Sr is the one who really needs to get professional help and STOP saying that he’s the victim! I am so tired of hearing him bleat that over and over while he thinks of ways to cut down Jr. Jr really doesn’t slam his dad, even when asked by others about what his immature father has done or said about him. Sr is the one who needs to grow up. Personally, I would like the show to continue with Jr and his crew. Mikey is, well, Mikey and doesn’t really add a whole lot to the show other than some benign entertainment.
INSPITE OF WHAT LAW FIRMS AND OTHERS SAY, RESPECT CUTS BOTH WAYS, THERE IS NO WAY I’D WORK FOR SOMEONE SO FOUL MOUTHED, AND TO ANSWER THAT LAW FIRM, WHAT ABOUT THE TIMES PAUL JR AND VINNIE WORK UNTIL THE EARLY HOURS, PAUL SR IS NOT THE ONE RUNNING THE FIRM, HE PAYS OTHERS TO DO THAT, ITS THE TV SHOW THAT MADE OCC BIG, NOT PAUL SR, ONCE PAUL SR REALISE’S ITS NOT HIS LOUD MOUTH THAT MAKES THE SHOW, ITS PAUL JR AND VINNIE, BECAUSE THAT ACCIDENT LAWYER THINKS PAUL SR BUILT THER FIRM, TRV MADE OCC BECAUSE ALL PAUL TEUTUL SR DOES IS SIT WITH HIS FEET UP AND LET OTHERS DO THE WORK, THE SHOW AND OCC WOULD AND COULD MANAGE WITHOUT THE LOUD MOUTH, I’VE GOT TWO SON’S AND THERE’S NO WAY I’D TALK TO THEM LIKE THAT, HOW CAN YOU GET YOUR SON’S TO RESPECT YOU WHEN YOU TALK TO THEM HOW HE DOES.
ive watched the show for years its wrong what sr is doing to jr,he makes an ass of himself the shit he does to jr sr needs to look at himself in the mirror he does not look good at all.life is short they all need to get it together,i feel bad for jr & mickey .there was a time when i didnt see my parents for a long time do to diffent problems{ex-husband}.the point is some day sr is gonna reach out for those boys and there not gonna be there.i have worked for my stepson for many yrs its tuff hes harder on me then any one else cause its family it makes for bad feelings,i wish paul jr all the luck in the world prove to sr you can do it,i never watched a show where sr did the designs made these custom bikes im sure at one time he did or he wouldnt have what he has again with out paul jr what are they putting out? i also think its wrong for sr sueing jr over the faro deal is it so to believe that they contacted him?
I believe Sr. is a jerk to Jr. because he feels guilty for missing out on the first 10 years of Jr.’s life because he was drunk and/or stoned. Sr. can’t give in to the fact that he’s getting old and Paulie is young, successful and still has his whole life ahead of him. Perhaps that’s why he wants a relationship with Mikey…he doesn’t feel threatened by Mikey’s success in the motorcycle fabrication business,altho Mikey I’m sure has his own talents. Same situation probably happened with Danny and the steel company…felt threatened. Why can’t he feel proud of his sons? He taught them his trades…he should feel PRIDE, not resentment. You said it yourself Sr. “life is short” . The almighty $ is not worth the time that you are not enjoying with your sons and their families.
Sr. treats Jr like crap. I dont watch the show for Sr. So in fact if it were not for Jr,,,, OCC would not be as big as it is. Jr made Sr rich and now Sr has all kinds of evil people in his ears giving him bad advice. Paul Jr is the talent Sr is the investor. I’d say he got his money back ten fold,,
It goes to show that money is the root of all evil.
Correction: it is the LOVE of money….Money is not the root of all evil or you would not be eating your next meal.
paulie and mikey need to realizr how lucky they been mikey don’t do crap besides draw pictures that my 3 year old can paulie thought he could come in at whatever time he wanted and vinnie even use to get pissed off but now hes working 4 him whatever they won’t wake up until it’s to late as far as senior goes keep doing what your doing their brats they been carried to long try not to let them get to ya!!!
… ciao:
a common , complaint is of jr’s arrival and departure times. on the surface of it, that makes sense. however, given a little thought, that situation takes on a different character. first, it does seem that jr is part owner of the business, not just an employee.
in addition, rick made mention of sr’s need to vent his anger. from my perspective, that was a function jr had to handle, and given that, the fact he came in at all, laudable at the very least. only a son/daughter would tolerate that kind of ongoing abuse.
the fact sr has NO relationships with any of his sons, suspect. his daughter, another story.
sr is one of these men that fail to realize, ommand of one’s self, always trumps having to control another …
I think the show would be better off without all the drama. take off the sons because without there dad they probably would not be nothing or have nothing.when your fathers gone he is gone. the problem with young ones is they don,t know the meaning of respect your elders until the elders are gone
You do realize that Discovery channel was set to cancel OCC when Sr fired Jr. And sue Sr for breach of contract right. So if it wasn’t for Jr, the show would have been scrapped long ago. In addition exactly when have you seen Sr build, let alone design a bike. And to have no contact with 3 sons, hmmmm I wonder whose fault that would be.
They actually did cancel the show. It came back in the new format Sr. v. Jr. I wrote a couple of articles that you can read on here if you search for American Chopper in the search box. Sr. is a business man, he does not build bikes, he has others do it for him. Jr. does not really build bikes either, he has certain customization skills, but he also needs others to do the sheet metal work, engine work, wiring work, etc. There are very few guys that do everything.
Norm
I started watching it again, just coincidence the brutal winter has me indoors. What strikes me is that the show is going down the road of the personal lives in a way that shows the things you should be paying attention too. Sr. has a serious anger management problem and has huge displacement / transference issues. Jr is no saint and is running late, partying too much, what else is new… now when you have that much money, you would think they could solve all their problems. Frankly its turning into a soap opera even looks like the producers did an inside look behind the scenes, which I unfortunately missed. The previews looked ugly if these guys cannot act human to each other how are they going to act human to anyone else. Still smells like a script though.
I have read these comments and some are pure comical. Sr. Is fowl mouth he’s old school from Yonkers, not a hillbilly. Sr. approach may me crass and intimidating but if it was not for his strictness Jr. wouldnt have what he has today. In all companies a non compete exist those who have never signed one lack in the successful department. Both Mikey and Jr. are unappreciative spoiled brats. Boys should grow up and realize you only have one father, good or bad as he is, he could have cut you both loose when you turned 18. Jr. would be eating bon bons in a trailer while watching Queer eye for the straight guy!! Mikey should go to Ethiopia so he can help starving children.
Bottom line Sr. had the money and Jr. had the artistic ability. One without the other and that company would never have gotten to the point it is. It’s a 50/50 deal plain and simple, and they’re both at fault. I understand the other brother that owns the ironworks business now isn’t talking to Sr. either, what’s up there?
I WILL TELL YOU THIS. IF IT WERNT FOR THE DISCOVERY CHANEL OOC WOULD BE LIKE ANY OTHER BIKE SHOP THAT STARTED IN THE MID 04-05 BOOM. OUTTA BUSINESSES. THAT BOTH NEED TO THANK DISCOVERY FOR CARRING THEM FOR LONG AS THEY DID. AND THE PAUL SR. NEEDS TO STOP CRYING AND GO THEIR OWN WAYS.
If it was not for the discovery channel, they would of been just another bike shop and outta business like the rest of the other custom builders. you seemed to forgot to report on that.
There is no bottom line here. You have two guys with way to much pride. They helped make each other whether or not they choose to see it. Sadly OCC is in some apparent trouble financialy because they expanded at the wrong time like so many other companies. Its sad that its a father and child thing and they are both to stupid to realise they are stronger together. I can’t compare my relationship with my father to theirs, my Dad would have gone to jail and lived in the street for his kids and as a son I would do all in my power to see that that didn’t happen. Remember this isn’t just one of his kids sadly its all but the daughter. PJD might make it they are the right size business for the times and maybe the kid has the chops to make it. It is my hope that whatever really went on is resolved, though it is entertaining T.V.that I hate myself for watching (but I still will)I hate lawyers for this very reason, though I understand their purpose.SR grow up you little stunts don’t make you look too good. JR. keep on the high road. To both swallow pride for family, resist ego for blood, and realise we are only on this earth for a short time..
You must be seeing a different Sr. than the rest of us. Sr. has been a pain in Jr’s side since the beginning and I think for the most part Jr. exhibited a lot of patience and controlled his own temper. What father thinks his son will make peace with him when he sues them; not once but twice now. They had an agreement that Jr. was to get a 25% interest. 25% of nothing is what Sr. offerred to buy him out. That sounds fair!!!! Jr. has moved on, designing and making his own bikes and is trying to live his life while Sr. is fixated with bad mouthing his son or planning some juvenile prank on his son that he knows won’t be found funny by anyone but him or some in his crew who wouldn’t say anything for fear of becoming his new target. Sr. is a jerk who sadly is dead to all three of his sons while he still walks around. As they say “You reap what you sow”.
Well put Claudia. Sr is acting like a spoiled brat, never stops running Jr down, and this while he owns 40+ muscle cars and now claims to be too broke to pay his mortgage on the shop. Funny, he doesn’t seem to have any trouble paying the mortgage on his home… It looks to me as if the foreclosure proceedings could be a legal game to attempt to show in court that Jr’s 20% isn’t worth anything.
Father and sons working together never really works, dad is still dad and son is still son in both their eyes.
I have to disagree with many of you in that Snr wants his prima donna son to work just as the others do. Not just walk off to do things in his personal life.
Jusy you try walking out at from work to go see something about your house for half a day. Your boss will soon get pissed off at that.
Jnr thinks he is bigger that OCC, he’s not he is a PART of it as is his father. As Snr started the company and is near the end of the fifties he is entitled to sit back a bit. lets face it he’s had a tough life, some of it his own making in the early years of his life. Since stating out in the steel works he has had to work hard to get it where it was when the other son took over.
He’s no mug to get where he is today.
You make some good points, Jr took advantage of his work time for sure, but the bikes did get done on time. I’d have a lot more sympathy for Sr if he didn’t have a law suit against Jr, and if he’s quit running Jr down.
They should have changed the name of the 01/31 episode to “The Irony Show” – Junior is threatening to fire Odie for showing up late / back-talking jr., ect.
As Uncle Ted would say: Where have we seen this before? The whole thing hinges on what we’re not seeing — the fight over the dwindling money supply & who gets what – don’t think they ever covered OCC’s fight w/the unions over the building’s const.,or the chapter 11 filing (that the right term, Norm?).
Seen this type of thing in families w/too much money before – Jr. & Mike thought they had a free ride for the rest of their lives Guess you could call it the “Teutle Curse” especially w/reality TV programs – Happy-go-lucky bikers/lawyers/cooks & bakers every day lives turn into soap operas before your very eyes when they get a smell (just a whiff) of Hollywood / Corporate Sponsor Mega Bucks —
Sr’s projects actually look better without Jr. –
Jr’s stuff looks the same (repetitive,pointless activity – indicating mental problems) Maybe they can do a deal w/Dr. Phil for Better ratings…….
Odie was being a total jerk, and I wouldn’t blame Jr if he turned around and fired him. I’m sure there are a LOT of talented people who would jump at the chance to work with Jr. Odie reminds me a bit of “Blue Dog” who never understood how lucky he was to be working with the people and talent he was with. And really, what does Odie contribute to a build??? Not much.
True, the last “Sr” bike was cool, the one for St Jude’s, but look how many people it took to replace Jr! Jr’s still building very nice bikes.
I always felt for Jr when Sr would ride in on a bike for an unvail as if he had built it all himself, on a bike that he hadn’t touched until just a minute before.
Also on lastnights show odie was fired from PJD for running his mouth.watching the last few show he has been looking to get fired from what i seen.Now he goes and see’s senior he lies to seniors face about what happened.He tells senior Jr has been acting like a jerk when he himself was he tells senior he walked out and quit when in fact jr told him to get out.Senior hires him.SENIOR HE LIED TO YOUR FACE KNUCKHEAD AND YOU GIVE HIM A JOB.fIRE ODIE SHOW HIM YOU WILL NOT TAKE HIS LYING BULL
well if you ask me who really cares it sucks that people are making allot of noise and drama over this, yes this sucks jr has allot of great talent and dad had the money and an existing business though they can work apart it still took both to start it i am a fabricator my self just like allot of talented people are today just remember one thing some of you started by yourself and did the work but if you started with a partner remember they started it with you no matter the outcome you trusted them enough to start a business.
I saw the AC marathon last night on DCY channel. For starters Sr is looking sick, I mean he looks like he might have cancer or something, he is tired and drained. Jr fired the punk for doing exactly the same kind of $hit that he was giving everyone at OCC, coming in late, running the mouth..not giving a shit…. Ironic but he does not see it. Odie is a spy though, a slimy spy at OCC. Nice to see Cody but wonder why he left ? Did not like the volume at OCC..wonder…. Now Jr snatched an insider from OCC and they snagged a few builds with OCC connections. They are in for additional legal woes. Non compete and non disclosure lawsuits are a hard lesson. The designer for the much famed Bratz doll line had to pay up big time and shut his successful operation down when he hired a mattel employee from the barbie group that was still under contract. . And now OCC is trying to “creatively” restructure their debt a’ la Donald Trump style. Smart, but they could make additional claims against Jr’ for [torturous] spelling ? interference and all sorts of nasty business legal heap Jr has no idea what he is getting himself into. Of course HIS lawyer is going to sing sweet nothings in his ear, his fee will go up for sure. If this keeps up the only ones with money will be the wives and the lawyers…Just cause Jr can paint a pretty bike together, does not mean Sr is out for the count. He still has a few rabbits up his sleeves. All good entertainment though, my wife wants to try mikeys “scream” therapy….
automan i completely with you on this but i have a small private shop with no employee’s and i pay the rent and there is still DRAMA i think some people in live can’t live with out it, my wife tells me to close it but that is where i build my cars
I own and operate my own 2 bay automotive repair shop in a small town. I have had no real employees the last 15 years because of one thing. None were responsible. They either failed to come in on time, or not at all, (drugs, alcohol, etc) Or they just did not care about the quality of their work. The one guy that came back with hat in hand and finally understood my mission, had to skip the country because he was wanted for fathering 5 children with 4 different women and he owed a kings ransom in child support. Sure there is plenty of drama with the parts situation out there. I had to laugh when one of the bikes off the shelf fuel tanks vent was leaking and they had the whole thing painted up ready to show. Life is like that and I think a lot of pressure is the deadlines. I try to keep a schedule but the wife hates it when I widow her to catch up when it seems all the parts finally show up at once but the bills got to get paid. I think the bottom line is that Sr is old school and has a hard on for the clock with things he can control and obsesses about deadlines too much. Jr is an artist and you cannot rush creativity. It needs to flow from the soul. You can see he does a good job with that. If Jr comes in late but works an all niter, whats the rub ? As long as it gets delivered. I worked briefly with a guy assembling bikes (in addition to my own repair work) and he was just a younger version of Sr. When our final argument happened, I blew him out of the water, saying “you told me it needed to be delivered on Thursday, It was ready on Thursday.” “Get out of my hair on Tuesday”…. MM. was bitching about how I was not “giving him service” (ludicrous) I told him he was being unreasonable and that I told him my before we started my ‘own shop came first” but I never botched a sale for him…(promised delivery) However I still think Sr’s rage is from his own sordid, drug and alcohol past and he sees Jr going down the same road. Both of them need to have a healing “good will hunting moment”…I could be all wrong but Jr’s nostrils get much bigger he could smoke a cigar through one of them. It looks like its a perpetual “snowstorm” up there. The dealers must be happy… Although the last few shows he appears to be more focused and centered. I think that Jr needs to row his own boat for a while then he will develop some respect for operations. If my observations are wrong I apologize. Its just the handwriting is on the wall and being in this business I know how impossible it is to get good help. Mikey, Vinnie and Danny are the only normal guys there. People should not be so hard on Mikey, he is caught in the middle of this curious situation. Mikey would be great in customer service, he is thoughtful, considerate, compassionate and looks inward and outward for solutions to serious problems his EGO does not get in the way of who he is and who he wants to be. Unlike the other 2. I really think he is the unsung hero of this whole drama. Not everybody can be buff and polished for the camera. Of course this is all entertainment so who knows how seriously the real story is.
Automan that was one hell of a long and well thought out response!
Norm
What a great post! Well written, insightful, fair to all, excellent work, thanks.
I’ve looked at some of the old TV clips and it was the same theme as today’s: Sr ripping Jr a new one. Yes, I agree Jr could have been more punctual in coming to work and not taking extended lunch breaks. Then, again, if he was working long hours to complete projects, and if you, too, had a verbally abusive boss riding your ass every waking momemnt, would you not want to avoid that stress KNOWING Sr was going to get in your face every moment he was at work? Sr has some serious anger management issues. Always saying he could do this and that 10 times faster than Jr, but never proving it. I have to admit he was great about sitting in his office, whining about HIM being the victim, bitching about Jr to EVERYONE within ear shot. I just don’t get it. What father rides his son like that without let up and then bleats on TV that he’s the victim, that without his sons around him his health is better and he’s doing better? He didn’t even have the guts to go to Jr’s wedding for Christ’s sake! What’s he going to do when Jr and his daughter have children and he won’t be allowed to see them? What a bitter, angry, and, yes, stupid old man he is. He’s already selling some of his collections on eBay (motorcycles), so I’m willing to bet he’s in some kind of financial trouble. What’s he going to do now without the stream of revenue from Discovery Channel for the weekly TV show? That’s got to hurt his financial bottom line very seriously. He sure didn’t think about that, or, perhaps, he thought berating his son all of the time was supposed to be good for ratings. What a maroon he is! Personally, I think he is still using drugs as he goes through way too many mood swings for me to believe he isn’t using drugs or booze again.
It is a privilege to work with your children. Paul Sr is a real jerk who constantly refuses to treat any one with the respect that they deserve.
Maybe, just maybe if Sr had spent some of Paul Jr’s childhood being a father instead of an alcoholic druggie, Paul Jr would treat him with more respect.
Sr taught Jr how to disrespect his father . . . period!
Totally agree with Victor..he was never there for his kids like most parents should be.
I watched OCC last night and find Snr’s attitude to Mikey appalling. He spoke to Mikey as if he had just wandered off the street. You could see the hurt in Mikey’s eyes when he was speaking. Paul Snr could not give a damn about his family, he has got the wealth, albeit until he messes up and he will, but he has lost something which money cannot buy and that is the love of a family.
For a CEO of a company to take his son into a board room then stick his boots onto the table sums Snr up, but there again thats all he did when the cameras were on him. Wake up Snr before you lose your family for good
Very sorry to conclude… After watching last nights re-run I have come to the conclusion that Sr is a liar, and a punk. The truth seldom comes from his mouth. His statements to Rick that Jr was refusing to sell the 20% to him was a total lie. Sr had the value of the 20% placed at (0) ZERO! He led Rick to believe that Jr had refused a reasonable offer. Zero is not a reasonable offer for 20% of that business in any reasonable persons mind. Sr is a total liar. He went on to lie saying the judge found completely in his favor. What the judge said I believe is, “Settle this mess with a fair accounting and buy out.” I doubt that the next company will return a verdict of Zero as the value of 20% of OCC.
And so I conclude, this show cannot be faked as no reasonable person would lead the world to believe they are a liar and punk, even for the money that is involved. Especially someone with an ego as big as Sr’s.
Come on Sr,!
Bury the ego and stop trashing your own flesh and blood on national TV.
You are digging a hole deeper and deeper each day. Why not embrace his success and offer a supporting hand? Would that be too hard?!
It looks like the constant public bashing is not working too well for you. I love you both but……. being in recovery myself, I lean toward mending fences.
Take care big guy!
My Wife and I both watch the show because both shops build good looking bikes. It’s always interesting to see what’s next. However, Paul Sr. is a disgusting bully with a foul mouth. Paul Jr. was smart to leave that angry environment and start his own shop. I’ve never seen a father so anxious to see his son fail as Paul Sr.. He is an example of having everything but having nothing! Junior is to be commended for looking after Mikey, as Mikey couldn’t look after himself.
Paul Sr. is an angry, hateful person who will no doubt die alone.
Junior is the calm brain in the business ,Senior is the foul mouthed front man, Mikey is the overweight buffoo. getreal its time for the business to move on with Junior at the controls and keep the lawyers at arms length .. what of Mrs T we havn’t heard from her yet, I’m sure she has something to say to whats going on so lets hear it Momma.
A view from across the pond…England
I watch (probably older re-runs) most evenings with my three year old. We’re addicted to the creative talent and engineering. I understand TV shows need an edge and the personalities give it that – but quite frankly we don’t need the soap opera. Same problem with Boyd Coddington – master class in man mis-management.
As for the business – I think businesses do need a business man (or woman) at the helm, but they don’t have to be so abrasive. I run an IT business and am pretty relaxed about what (or when) the guys do things – so long as they get done.
I reckon given a chance(and some support) Mikey could run OCC with jnr doing the same thing. Sure there are thousands of bike builders out there – but jnr is talented.
Check out our local bike shop http://www.krazyhorse.co.uk/
mine is the iron head flat tracker.
Vadge
I have watched OCC off and on over the past few years and find it brilliant but at times disturbing. The end product is not the problem, the bikes speak for themselves, the problem is how the end product is achieved.
While viewers watch the mayhem, window smashing, insults and emotional stress to all concerned, the biggest problem is Paul Snr. He has allowed problems to develope, he has never been a good mentor to Mikey or Paul jnr.
Paul Snr should have taken the necessary steps earlier to run a well organised ship complete with crew. He should have sat Paul Jnr down, explained what was required of him and end with if this cannot be achieved then we will have to go our way, instead he has taken the cowards way. He has let other staff have their say when it comes to dealings. Paul Snr should have led by example, I find it hard to take on board he has failed the people who matter most, sons Paul Jnr and Mikey. Mikey as we know can be very vunerable and needs a father figure.
It is like watching Hotrod, same issues, end product fantastic but achieving products left a lot to be desired..Duane was an absolute kid, could never organise the proverbial piss up in a brewery…need I say any more.
I used to watch the program, but i just sick and tried of all the yelling and agro, its never productive and do not even watch the program any more because it does not interest me. TLC and discovery channel must need to look at what really people want to see, yelling and screaming, does not work for me. The world is in an oil crisis which could have been solved over twenty years ago, the the american auto makers visited President Clinton, with the introduction of hybrid and electric cars back then. No, the american government had to appease the auto manufacturers and oil companies. Big bikes with plenty of noise (there are EPA noise standards which appear to be broken) and seeing them ride bikes without helmets or not wearing seat belts. Don’t you have enough problems with your national road toll of 50,000 per annum. The feud is pitiful, Snr is aggressive, rude and violent which must be due to the steroids because you do not get bulked up like that through weights and diet alone and mood changes are typical of steroid use, ask anyone. You can not be imaginative on a 7am to 3pm shift and still be asked or expected to work overtime, to meet dead lines. You do it once, twice and then they expect it to be normal and pat you on the back. Jnr did his hours and the crew knew what to do by the time he got back to work the next day. Paul Snr has issues with pain and how he manages it and its obvious that he has taken steroids and prescription mediation for his back pain. The GFC has happen through fraud and the lack of guts by the law and government to prosecute, where companies are folded with assets being stripped or transferred and your left with nothing when you are a creditor trying to get your money back when you invested in good faith. You wonder if assets have not been transferred to make it look like company is going bust. I hope everyone can solve their issues, the first thing is being able to concede and look at the facts and being just and equitable, then we would not have conflicts, disputes and wars.
I remembered when American Chopper was just about how to build motorcycles, with a little shouting match here or there. I was reading the comments on this page when I was the preview of the new season of SR vs JR. It’s a shame that there going at each other like this. Maybe after one finally beats the other, or a major death in the family, they will finally come to terms with each other.
SENIOR HAS DONE NOTHING BUT RANT AND RAVE AT HIS EMPLOYEES AND ESPECIALY JUNIOR, MIKEY SEEMS TO GET AWAY WITH IT. PAUL JNR IS THE DESIGNER IN THE FIRM HE HAS A FANTASTIC VISION WHICH HE INTERPRETS TO A VERY HIGH STANDARD. IF ONLY SENIOR COULD STOP BAD MOUTHING HIM AND MAYBE HELP HIM AND APRECIATE HIS TALENT THEN THERE WOULD BE NO NEED FOR ALL THE ANIMOSITY. DOES SENIOR REALISE HOW RIDICULOUS HE LOOKS, AFTER ALL THE YELLING I NOTICE HE IS RIGHT THERE IN THE LIMELIGHT TAKING THE CREDIT,GOOD LUCK TO YOU JUNIOR.
KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK.
Hey I glad yous see Paul Jr Talent.
The fussing & fighting have taken the pleasure out of watching the show.
Sure is a shame they do not do what they do best…..build bikes.
One can only wonder how much longer the sponsors will keep shelling out money that makes these two birds multi millionaires??
I was shocked to hear that Sr had another son he had been fueding with and had not talked to in 8 years. After reflection I realized it was naive of me to be shocked after watching the way he is treating Jr.
Come on Paul Sr is a Joke. He takes all of you types for your money and your personal commitments. Wake up OCC is in Receivership the big church I mean new building is for sale and Paul Jr new company is flourishing and his house is paid for and his girlfriend keeps working on herself a type a woman you can only dream of. You and your Father would abuse you just like Sr does to his kids. Real sad Sr should beg Jr for his help. Sr should start planning his retirement. I saw a show where you had some worker helping Sr at his house Sad he should be working with his own family members.
Did Paul Sr give you a bike or a discount to say good words about Him and make Paul Jr look like a loser………….
“I don’t want this law suit, never wanted it.” “I just want what is mine.” Sr.
Errr… if he never wanted the suit, why bring it??
Want’s what is his… Well, he made Jr part owner of the company because of his hard work and effort, and now wants it back. However he found an accounting company that set the value of Jr’s portion of OCC at Zero… If that is so, why does Sr even want a minority portion of a company that’s worth nothing back??? Perhaps it’s not really worth Zero?? 🙂
i enjoy watching the tv show,i know a lot is put on
for the cameras but life is short and a family breakup
is terrible,so kiss and make up
dave the rave
Paul Sr. I have been a fan since the first show, i even watch all the repeats now. Im writing you because of the things happening with you an Paul Jr.an Mickie. I have nt seen or talked to my 2 sons since my wife passed away, 10 years ago this lady was the love of my life for 40 years. To make along story short it comes down to us rising 2 men, an these 2 girls turning them to ass kissing babys. Excuse my words but thats the only way i can say it. I know i can go on an on what i trying to say is you an him are from the same moled, an hard headed. You are alot of the blame also, as is he is. You have a great chance of getting back with him an Mickie, i will never forgive my sons for what they did to this beautiful lady even to the day she passed away. Go for it Big guy i know how you feel but 2 different stories. I could write a book about this, by watching the shows your sons really want to get back with you. They don t have to come back an work for you, just be family. Thanks for your time, AL FERRARA, CREAM RIDGE, NEW JERSEY
Does anybody notice that Paul Sr. stopped raging against his son at the same time he started losing his size? Sr.’s name came up in a steroids scandal in Florida. Sr.stopped raging about the same time he stopped taking Steroids. Now it appears that the only thing stopping a relationship is his fathers stupidity and ignorance.
My impression of the “old man” is that he is a poor excuse of a parent. the most important job a man has is the responcibility he has towards his children.
he suffers from a massive ego trip due to his TV fame, but fame and fortune are fleeting and the only true hertige a man has is his children.
I am starting to think that the entire family is a cluster fuck.
Norm
What a joke that show has become. It will be gone in less then one year I bet.
I agree. Their only customers are corporate and business types who buy bikes and probably pay more so that they are featured on a high rating show. There really is no biker or motorcyclist part of it at all. There is a car show called West Coast Customs which is the same deal.
We need some real biker shows on the air.
Norm
sure its never cool when father/sons fall out, but more often than not an important part of the relationship. sons need to get out from under fathers that life deal with it, the fact that sr can be a bully just made it more strained. the man (sr) shows himself to be a coward back biting callin manes stopping people having contact with jr, its sr that needs to grow a pair go to his son say hes sorry and put shit behind them for their relationship.As far as the business goes why would jr go back to occ, 5 years and pjd will be bigger better and busier than occ. what the father tends to forget is that the son starting to learn at a younger age normally far sepasses the father,thats the real reason sr wants jr to fail so he can have him back at occ cos they need him.
Wow you are entitled to your opinion Mr Lawyer.
But OCC success can almost entirely to Paul Jr’s creativity! The designs came from the mind of Paul Jr.
Sr hired business & office staff to do his work! Then Sr attempted to drive the business into the ground because of their attempts to devalue the company! Almost did nose dive by defaulting on the banks!
After visiting OCC I don’t like any of their bikes!
Norm
Come on guys, get together and put the past behind you. I’m still watching the TV shows and I love it when the air is so blue, I wish I’d taken up Morse code. Families should stay together no matter what. Jnr., you only have one father and no matter how he riles you, surely you know it,s done because he cares. Snr.. You should stand back and realise that things and fashions change, you have to let go of the past and look toward the future. It’s your sons that will, if you let them carry on the tradition of turning out some of the most iconic motorcycles ever produced, and the enjoyment of seeing the progression from design ideas to final build is tremendous. Come guys shake hands and get those bikes out.
Family is important than anything.
Your all stupid jr. Should have left earlier because his father never respected him even on television!
And if Paul, Sr. ever started “apologizing” to his sons and workers, it would take him the rest of his lofe, if he lived to be 500 years old. Paul, Sr, is a street thug made good and he treats everyone he meets like siht!
Yep, bike designers and fabricators ARE a dime-a-dozen. But good ones, like Paul, Jr., are not.
If I’d started working at OCC, me and Old Man Paul would’ve gotten along about as long as it took me to pick up my tools, put them in my truck, and leave. He’s not only an asshole, as you said, he’s a gold-plated asshole.
Old Episodes: Customer arrives with project, Jr. gets started and Sr. oversees work adds his two sense. Timeframe is tight and they may not make it, fights breakout about something. Troops rally and finish project on time, Jr. says this is the most challenging bike so far, best one they did so far (until next show). Sr. rides bike out and unveils it and customer is heaping praise on how fantastic bike turned out. Rinse and Repeat next episode.
New Series: Same plot as old, no arguments just mud slinging. Timeframe problems still abound, customer still going ape over the 150k motorcycle they just bought but can’t ride.
End result is family becomes wealthy and is torn apart. Now that TV is over I believe it will be hard to maintain the overhead Sr. created in his business and it will shrink to a small bike shop. Paul Jr. is more inventive and will explore other opportunities as long as the money lasts. If something he does eventually succeeds he will be ok, if not I see the family circle the wagons and return to a small bike shop just like they where before TV came calling.
I love watching your show and hope father and son can work on some bike again. I ride a Harley Davidson 1200 myself keep having problem om it starting now. By myself serve in the military over 21 years total got hurt . I know you all are the best out there when it come to motor cycles wish I could have your touch on it.
sure they both got big heads and big egos over that show. JR got his from SR. SR. is the reason that family is dysfunctional. mikey kinda says it all. just because SR. started a business and and turned it into a motorcycle building shop does not mean he has all the brains. if not for JR’s vision and design’s all SR. would have is a every day custom motorcycle shop that are a dime a dossen. i see it as SR. brow beating JR. to the point of not wanting to come into work to deal with his ASS HOLE father. he is just a bully with a big ego. sewing your son for damages after you fire him says a lot to how big his ego really is. i had friends growing up that there fathers put them to work in there businesses and were taught how to grow the business. not brow beat them. eventually turning the business over to them . Paul SR. was a bully befor the show started , during the show and still being a bully after JR. is gone. big ego bully’s never change. i bet mikey could tell a lot. now if i had a father like that i would not have given him my shares either. so for Paule JR. keep the rubber side down buddy and i hope your new business grows. and be better to that new little son of yours then your dad has been to you , and Mikey keep on truckin.
So how’d that work out for sr lost the lawsuit was sued and lost how many times? Now bankruptcy yeah heck of a good decision huh…
Have no clue!
Norm